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Activate "FAF" leg

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romans@romflight.com View Drop Down
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    Posted: 02 Sep 2020 at 2:31pm
ATC vectored me in tight on a RNAV approach and gave me a heading which would place me apx 1.5 miles from the FAF.  I proceeded to activate the FAF leg yet that soft-button was not available to me.  I opted to activate the leg one prior and that worked fine.  the GPS then sequenced and the approach continued.  Any idea on which condition may have prevented the IFD440 from making the FAF leg active?
roman
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dmtidler View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dmtidler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Sep 2020 at 6:25pm
I think more information would be helpful to get a full understanding of the scenario:

What specific approach (with transition or vectors)?
What was the IFD active waypoint before trying to Activate Leg to the FAF?
What IFD waypoint was highlighted on the FMS - FPL tab?
Were there any gaps in the flight plan prior to the FAF?


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romans@romflight.com View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote romans@romflight.com Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Sep 2020 at 7:29pm
sorry for the ambiguity.  i see how it may matter.
this was the MMU RNAV (Z) R23 loaded from EMRSN.  i was under ATC vectors and decided to have the IFD go Direct EMRSN.  I had my OBS already set for inbound 229 and the IFD was reminding me to set the original course to EMRSN, which i believe was 355.

I do not know what the FPL page had.
There weren't any gaps when i briefed and checked the approach.
upon receipt of my final vector to intercept, is where i wanted to activate the leg BADDA-BING.
Thanks.
roman
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Ibraham View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ibraham Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Sep 2020 at 11:37am
Did you have the IFD in GPS or OBS mode?
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romans@romflight.com View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote romans@romflight.com Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Sep 2020 at 12:06pm
good question:
It was in GPS mode since it kept reminding me to set the course to EMERSN, which i wrote about before. I had already set my course to the final of 227 knowing i'd be vectored around.   Had the unit been in OBS mode,  it will not offer any reminders as to how to set the OBS.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dmtidler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Sep 2020 at 12:35pm
I tried your scenario in the IFD Trainer iPad app and it worked fine.

Just to confirm, there is not an activate FAF leg LSK. In order to activate that leg in this scenario, one would have to use Activate Leg by effectively doing the following:

1) Verify that BADDA and BINGG are indeed connected without gaps in the FMS FPL tab. If the approach was selected as a non-vectors approach from the procedures database as described, this should not be in question. 

2) Verify that BINGG is the highlighted cursor waypoint on the FMS-FPL tab. If not, make it the highlighted waypoint. In your scenario, I can imagine that EMRSN may have still been the highlighted waypoint as you said you had last performed a direct-to EMRSN. If EMRSN was both the active waypoint and the cursor highlighted waypoint on your FMS-FPL, then the Activate Leg LSK would not have been available as an LSK option.

3) If conditions one and two are satisfied, there should be an Activate Leg option at LSK 1.



Edited by dmtidler - 05 Sep 2020 at 12:35pm
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romans@romflight.com View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote romans@romflight.com Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Sep 2020 at 2:06pm
I appreciate your responses.  this is baffling as i wrote before,  the "LSK 1" did offer me the activate leg for the FIX prior to BING, which was BADDA.  I still suspect there was something that being the FAF and the current state.

I will fly this approach again for sure and will pay close attention.
roman
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dmtidler View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dmtidler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Sep 2020 at 7:06pm
Originally posted by romans@romflight.com romans@romflight.com wrote:

ATC vectored me in tight on a RNAV approach and gave me a heading which would place me apx 1.5 miles from the FAF.  I proceeded to activate the FAF leg yet that soft-button was not available to me.  I opted to activate the leg one prior and that worked fine.  the GPS then sequenced and the approach continued.  Any idea on which condition may have prevented the IFD440 from making the FAF leg active?

OK...I ran another several IFD Trainer app simulations completely in heading select as you described and think I may have your answer. Ironically, the possible answer was actually mentioned in your description of the event. My theory is that as you were vectored on this approach past EMRSN the IFD was auto-sequencing your active leg based on your vectoring. By the time you were on your intercept heading and wanted to to manually update the active leg to BINGG, the IFD had already beat you to it by auto-sequencing to the BADDA to BINGG leg...only in the heat of battle, you didn't realize it. That's why you couldn't get an Activate Leg LSK prompt. The leg from BADDA to BINGG was active and BINGG was your already the IFD active waypoint. 

There is still one piece that doesn't fit. If the BADDA to BINGG leg was auto-sequenced to be active, and subsequently GODLY to BADDA was manually sequenced to be the active leg, I could not get the IFD Trainer app to auto-sequence back to the BADDA to BINGG leg. At this point; however, the BADDA to BINGG leg could be manually activated using the Activate Leg LSK.

While the IFD PG doesn't go into much detail about the mechanics of waypoint auto-sequencing, it appears the trigger to auto-sequence to the next leg appears to be passing either over or flight plan track abeam the active waypoint. It appears that if BADDA to BINGG was already auto-sequenced to be active, then the IFD would be passed the the point to trigger that leg again when the IFD was subsequently manually sequenced to an GODLY to BADDA leg.


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romans@romflight.com View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote romans@romflight.com Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Sep 2020 at 6:28am
much appreciated.  I ran a few trainer approaches myself and agree. I like your words "heat of the battle" and with that, am not sure how the sequence went down after i manually activated the leg to BADDA.  perhaps i selected Direct BING?

thanks again for your assistance.  i will fly this one again for sure.
roman
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