IFD Nav Source for GI275? |
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ddgates
Senior Member Joined: 12 Aug 2011 Location: Deer Valley Status: Offline Points: 1100 |
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Posted: 14 Jul 2020 at 5:13pm |
More functionality is coming out of the GI275, including ability to drive the GFC500 autopilots.
I was told unequivocally that the IFD series are not on the approved navigator list. Are there any plans to address this? Unknown to me if that is something that Avi can do or G* has to do?
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David Gates
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MarkZ
Senior Member Joined: 05 Sep 2015 Location: 0TX0 Status: Offline Points: 172 |
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I’ve considered this as a way to rid myself of a vacuum system. I understand the GI-275 will drive a 400B but it’s going to have to do it with an IFD540 if it goes in my panel. Any chance a new PFD/MFD be on the horizon from the elfs in the back room in Melbourne?
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chflyer
Senior Member Joined: 24 Jan 2013 Location: LSZK Status: Offline Points: 1026 |
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Thread drift ....
One way to get rid of the vacuum system is to install an uAvionix AV-30 (STC pending, paperwork with FAA). From their web site: "We are asking for approval to utilize the AV-30 as a stand-alone attitude indicator, attitude indicator and directional gyro (dual unit installation), installation as a replacement for the turn coordinator (leaving the existing attitude indicator in place), and as the required backup in an EFIS installation. If the installation configuration leaves no instruments that require a vacuum source, the vacuum pump system may be removed from the aircraft via a 337 field alteration process. The removal of the vacuum system is not included in the AV-30-C STC approval." ... would likely cost about the same as replacing a TC should it fail. |
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Vince
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ddgates
Senior Member Joined: 12 Aug 2011 Location: Deer Valley Status: Offline Points: 1100 |
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Back to original question.
Will the IFD get included as approve nav source for the GI275?
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David Gates
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AviSteve
Admin Group Joined: 12 Feb 2018 Location: Melbourne, FL Status: Offline Points: 2213 |
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I'm assuming that the "approved navigator list" that you're referencing is in the Garmin Installation Manual. If so, Avidyne has no control over that list.
The GI275 is obviously new, so it is not included in our STC. Our STC does get updated from time to time. Whether a particular piece of equipment is referenced in the STC is based on several factors including market demand, equipment availability, value proposition, manpower, etc. Whether the GI275 will be included in the next STC update, whenever that might be, is yet to be determined.
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Steve Lindsley
Avidyne Engineering |
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ddgates
Senior Member Joined: 12 Aug 2011 Location: Deer Valley Status: Offline Points: 1100 |
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Thanks, my suspicion is that it is the same interface as the G5, and one would expect a lot of GI275s will be sold now that it supports the GFC500.
So please add it to your list. Thanks!
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David Gates
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SB Jim
Senior Member Joined: 30 Aug 2012 Status: Offline Points: 206 |
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As a Century III owner (mine still works great) I’m very interested in an upgrade path that allows me to retain the C-III.
If the new GI-275 doesn’t play nicely with my IFD 540 that would be a big problem (for me).
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jeffcb
Newbie Joined: 05 Apr 2018 Status: Offline Points: 31 |
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I am very keen to have 2 GI 275's and GFC 500 interface with my IFD 540, as it seems to be the most complete solution, and will be available for Comanches soon.
I am unhappy to see that the lack of height above ground info from the IFD 540 prevents GFC 500 underspeed protection etc from working. I hope Avidyne is able to remedy these issues soon, as I don't want to have to go to a Garmin Navigator instead of my IFD 540. Thanks to the contributors of this forum for bringing these issues to light, as I was unaware of them. Regards Jeff
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Jeff
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Bweb99
Newbie Joined: 05 Jun 2019 Location: Pittsburgh, PA Status: Offline Points: 19 |
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The IFD 540 nor the 440 are approved as the GPS source/navigator on G*’s installation manual nor the IFD 540/440 installation approved interface equipment list from Avidyne for either the G5 Attitude Indicator nor the GFC500. Many long discussions on this site about including this very popular component but it has never been included. So I doubt the GI275 would be any different. It does have the GAD 42 Nav interface on Avidyne’s approved equipment list.
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Bweb99
Newbie Joined: 05 Jun 2019 Location: Pittsburgh, PA Status: Offline Points: 19 |
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so far “crickets” on this issue. I wish I had read all of this website before we installed our G5/GFC500 with our two IFD540’s. We are working diligently with our installation shop to find a solution.
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chflyer
Senior Member Joined: 24 Jan 2013 Location: LSZK Status: Offline Points: 1026 |
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What exactly is the problem? The GFC500 supports GNS devices in the STC, and the Avidyne can be installed as a compatible replacement for that. GNS connection to a G5 AI also needs a GAD29B, and as mentioned above, that is also supported by the IFD. I have a G5/GAD29B/IFD540 installed for over a year and am considering replacing my STEC30 with the GFC500, so I'm interested in hearing of roadblocks to that route.
Edited by chflyer - 18 Jul 2020 at 2:45pm |
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Vince
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ddgates
Senior Member Joined: 12 Aug 2011 Location: Deer Valley Status: Offline Points: 1100 |
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There is even a video on youtube from Avi tech support (TJ) outlining the connection between the IFD and the G5.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OnXLT7NcTRs Edited by ddgates - 18 Jul 2020 at 1:37pm |
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David Gates
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Froethel
Groupie Joined: 02 Apr 2016 Location: Selden, NY Status: Offline Points: 54 |
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I installed 2G5’s, GAD42, a KFC500 already having an IFD 540 in my Cessna 182. Everything works perfectly and I couldn’t be happier.
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Frank
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dmtidler
Senior Member Joined: 12 Feb 2016 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 617 |
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Did you mean a GFC500 vs KFC500? If so, did you have a GAD 42 installed as well as a GAD 29B?
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Froethel
Groupie Joined: 02 Apr 2016 Location: Selden, NY Status: Offline Points: 54 |
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yes, a typo. It is a GFC500 and I believe I have both the GAD42 and the GAD 29B.....but I’ll check to confirm the GAD 29 B
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Frank
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Froethel
Groupie Joined: 02 Apr 2016 Location: Selden, NY Status: Offline Points: 54 |
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I checked, and I have both, GAD42 and GAD29 B
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Frank
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dmtidler
Senior Member Joined: 12 Feb 2016 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 617 |
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Interesting, do you know where the GAD 42 is wired into the system (i.e. between the IFD540 and the GAD 29B)? Were both the GAD 42 and GAD 29B added to your airplane during the G5 and/or GFC 500 install?
Edited by dmtidler - 18 Jul 2020 at 8:59pm |
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Froethel
Groupie Joined: 02 Apr 2016 Location: Selden, NY Status: Offline Points: 54 |
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yes, everything was added in the G5 and GFC 500 install.....but I couldn’t tell,you how it is wired.
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Frank
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martinhorton
Newbie Joined: 10 Nov 2020 Location: Texas Status: Offline Points: 1 |
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I own a Comanche. Where did you get the idea that the GFC500 would be available for the Comanches. I know that STEC is certifying the 3100 but I thought Garmin had dropped the GFC500 on Comanches, or at least pushed it back.
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SB Jim
Senior Member Joined: 30 Aug 2012 Status: Offline Points: 206 |
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Hello Avidyne,
Any update on GI-275 functionality with the IFD 540? Now I’m seriously considering dual GI-275’s to replace my air driven horizon and King HSI, it would enable me to get rid of the air gyro system (pump, regulator, filter, plumbing, gauge, etc.), have fail over redundancy, internal battery backups, GPSS steering, plus it will drive my Century III autopilot.
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chflyer
Senior Member Joined: 24 Jan 2013 Location: LSZK Status: Offline Points: 1026 |
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What exactly does the GAD 42 do and why is it needed? The usually loquacious Germin web site doesn't give any usable information on the GAD 42. I have a single G5 AI, IFD, and GAD29B but no GAD42. The GAD29B provides the 2-way communication interface between the IFD (ARINC) and the G5 (CAN-bus). The G5 has RS232 input but otherwise needs the CAN-bus which is where the GAD29B comes in.
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Vince
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Cruiser
Senior Member Joined: 24 Feb 2017 Location: Ohio Status: Offline Points: 139 |
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The GAD 42 offers the following interface possibilities:
ARINC 407 format 3-wire XYZ synchro Heading input ARINC 407 format 3-wire XYZ synchro or 4-wire Sin/Cos
Selected Course Drive ARINC 407 format 3-wire XYZ synchro or 4-wire Sin/Cos
Remote Selected Course Input ARINC 407 format 3-wire XYZ synchro or 4-wire Sin/Cos
GPS RMI/OBI output ARINC 407 format 3-wire XYZ synchro or 4-wire Sin/Cos
NAV RMI/OBI output (when interfaced with GNS 430/530) ARINC 561 format analog roll steering output for use
with flight control systems ARINC 561/568 distance display on compatible indicators ARINC 561 6-wire interface for Rockwell Collins EHSI 74 & EFIS 85/86
King serial distance display on compatible indicators ARINC 545/KIFIS XYZ synchro or ARINC 565 AC/DC TAS input RS-422 serial data input from Rockwell Collins digital course selector RS-422 serial data NAV/ILS output for Rockwell Collins EFIS 85/86
(when interfaced with GNS 430 or GNS 530) ARINC 429 Low speed/High speed conversion ARINC 429 Binary/BCD distance conversion
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chflyer
Senior Member Joined: 24 Jan 2013 Location: LSZK Status: Offline Points: 1026 |
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Thanks. For the most part, that looks like information needed for a G5 as HSI but not AI.
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Vince
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Phidoug
Newbie Joined: 01 Jun 2017 Location: Stockton, CA Status: Offline Points: 17 |
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Also anxiously awaiting an official word on IFD/GI-275 support.
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MarkZ
Senior Member Joined: 05 Sep 2015 Location: 0TX0 Status: Offline Points: 172 |
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I’d like to see the 550 drive an autopilot.
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PA23
Senior Member Joined: 12 Oct 2019 Location: MMU Status: Offline Points: 317 |
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I was looking through the installation for the G5 and the GAD 42, unless I'm reading it wrong according to the G5 installation manual the GAD 42 is Only used with non-WAAS GNS and non-
Garmin Autopilot is interfaced (Garmin's emphasis not mine). I don't see the KFC500 listed in the G5 install manual, maybe that's why the GAD 42 was needed?
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SB Jim
Senior Member Joined: 30 Aug 2012 Status: Offline Points: 206 |
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Me too. I was told today by an avionics shop that they will not quote a dual GI 275 installation for me because they have no way to get it approved. Not good for Avidyne or Garmin.
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teeth6
Senior Member Joined: 10 Mar 2014 Status: Offline Points: 741 |
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I join the group hoping that the GI275 will be added to Avidyne’s STC. I wanted to install the GFC500 autopilot and got this reply from the radio shop. “Unfortunately at this point there is no STC approval to interface the Avidyne IFD's to the GI-275. Functionally the interface will work so I expect it to be added either to the GI-275 STC Installation Manual or the Avidyne IFD STC Installation Manual at some point in the future. There are other Avidyne users interested in GI-275 installation so hopefully sooner than later.” Edited by teeth6 - 08 Apr 2021 at 11:06pm |
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SB Jim
Senior Member Joined: 30 Aug 2012 Status: Offline Points: 206 |
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<bump>
Any update on this? I’m still very interesting in getting dual GI-275’s to go with my IFD 540 and still have no STC path from Garmin or Avidyne that will allow the installation. ???
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teeth6
Senior Member Joined: 10 Mar 2014 Status: Offline Points: 741 |
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Last I heard, Avidyne was planning to include the GI 275 in their IM but that won’t ne happening until release 10.3.0.2 at the earliest. As we are still waiting on 10.3, I’m guessing it will be sometime in early 2022.
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Bob H
Senior Member Joined: 26 Jan 2018 Location: NH - KMHT Status: Offline Points: 290 |
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So, why can't a field approval be done? I have a G5 interfaced with my IFD and my aircraft is not on the AML, simply because Garmin mistakenly left it off. They have no plans to update the list.
I would think that as long as the protocols are compatible and the shop certifies that it works, a field approval should suffice. Garmin will never put Avidyne equipment on their STC. They want to push customers to only use their equipment.
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Bob
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teeth6
Senior Member Joined: 10 Mar 2014 Status: Offline Points: 741 |
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I’m sure a field approval could be attempted if someone wanted to go through that exercise. For the G5, it was my understanding it is a legal install as it is already in the Avidyne IM.
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Bob H
Senior Member Joined: 26 Jan 2018 Location: NH - KMHT Status: Offline Points: 290 |
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Bob
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teeth6
Senior Member Joined: 10 Mar 2014 Status: Offline Points: 741 |
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in your case, because the G5 is listed in the Avidyne IM, A field approval was not needed even though the IFD is not on the Garmin list. To get a field approval, the local FSDO would have to be involved and since these are primary flight instruments, I suspect flight testing might be done. Once the GI 275 is listed in the Avidyne IM, A field approval will not be needed even though the IFD is still not listed in the Garmin paperwork
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Bob H
Senior Member Joined: 26 Jan 2018 Location: NH - KMHT Status: Offline Points: 290 |
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I can't speak to the nuances of Field Approvals, STCs, 337s, etc. So, let me ask, do you believe that Avidyne's IM approving the interface between the G5 and the IFD takes precedence over the Garmin STC, which doesn't list my aircraft as approved for installing the G5?
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Bob
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teeth6
Senior Member Joined: 10 Mar 2014 Status: Offline Points: 741 |
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I would not say that it takes precedence but it is certainly equal and makes your installation perfectly legal
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Bob H
Senior Member Joined: 26 Jan 2018 Location: NH - KMHT Status: Offline Points: 290 |
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Interesting. So, I have a Garmin G5 STC, which doesn't provide approval for installation in my aircraft, but the Avidyne IM makes the installation legal without any additional approvals needed. Not what I would have expected. I don't think my avionics installer would agree with that, which is why I believe he did an additional approval step.
To me, the Avidyne IM provides no information about what aircraft the G5 can legally be installed in, only that it is allowed to be interfaced with an IFD. Then again, I'm not an expert on the approvals and paperwork required.
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Bob
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teeth6
Senior Member Joined: 10 Mar 2014 Status: Offline Points: 741 |
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Bob
I apologize. I thought your issue was the G5 being legal to work with the IFDs, which it is because of the Avidyne IM. I didn’t realize you were talking about the G5 being legal in your particular aircraft which, of course, the Avidyne IM has nothing to do with that.
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Bob H
Senior Member Joined: 26 Jan 2018 Location: NH - KMHT Status: Offline Points: 290 |
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That's OK. I just wanted to make sure we were on the same page. My reference above to the AML probably should have been clearer. Glad we are aligned.
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Bob
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SB Jim
Senior Member Joined: 30 Aug 2012 Status: Offline Points: 206 |
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Field approvals are just fine if the local FSDO is willing to do one. A local shop I contacted said the local FSDO is “too busy” and won’t do field approvals.
That’s why I need Garmin or Avidyne to provide an STC or no upgrade will be happening to my panel.
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teeth6
Senior Member Joined: 10 Mar 2014 Status: Offline Points: 741 |
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My A&P told me my local FSDO will no longer do field approvals. You must hire and pay a person to go through the process on your behalf. I’m told this person is also an FAA employee but I’ve not confirmed this info
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atomsite
Newbie Joined: 05 Jun 2020 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 27 |
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Hopefully Avidyne will add the GI275 to the IFD installation manual. The STC stipulates acceptable avionic interfaces as identified in the IFD installation manual. I believe the GI275 has like five different configurations (ADI, HSI, CDI, MFD, EIS) available. Avidyne will have to purchase some GI275s and integrate them into a system. That will require an upgrade to the firmware and to the documentation. It won't be cheap. Hopefully they have some development money lying around that they can spend on this.
Edited by atomsite - 15 Sep 2021 at 3:08pm |
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