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OK, nearly end of summer

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Gring View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gring Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Nov 2017 at 6:50am
I think it is just a mistyping and they are both the same thing. ADS-R is ADSB rebroadcast. This is the data your ADSB in receiver gets from the ground station. In the case of single band receivers, it gets traffic outputting on the other band. There is some other stuff, but the key to remember you are getting the information from an ADSB ground based transmitter and not from the actual target airplane(s).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chflyer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Nov 2017 at 12:17pm
Thanks for the clarification.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Catani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Nov 2017 at 3:00pm
Originally posted by glassanza glassanza wrote:

Was in Class C a few months ago and almost collided with a 172, never showed up on ADR-R or TIS-B and the controller never mentioned the target. Great advances which I appreciate and have paid for but it still is not a perfect system from my experience. Not complaining, just hoping for additional improvement by the end of the in 2020 mandate. 
Several possible reasons for this, one of which is the target has no transponder of any kind.  But others include equipment limitations - not all ADS-B solutions are capable of detecting all transponder-equipped targets, and/or installation issues, and/or operational issues (setting the box not to detect beyond a limited range).  I've had my ADS-B solution on board for about 500 flight hours, flying in a dense GA environment, and I've never seen a target my dual-band ADS-B and TAS combo box did not announce or display first, unless I had purposefully limited what I wanted it to display.

Consequently, I do not suspect a report of an aircraft sighted but not detected by ADS-B or TAS equipment is anything more than a target without any kind of transponder, or a receiving aircraft with equipment limitations - and no indication the ADS-B or TAS system itself is failure prone or inadequately designed.

I think every aircraft and drone should be required to have on board a box that responds to ADS-B and/or Mode C transponder interrogations.  The airspace we fly in is not private property.


Edited by Catani - 28 Nov 2017 at 3:04pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gring Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Nov 2017 at 3:26pm
Quote I think every aircraft and drone should be required to have on board a box that responds to ADS-B and/or Mode C transponder interrogations.

I could not disagree with this statement more.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote glassanza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Nov 2017 at 6:15pm
Pardon my earlier typo and I appreciate the clarification from Gring. I too agree with Catani regarding this issue, with more and more things aloft these days I would like the opportunity to see as many of them as possible.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stiletto1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 2017 at 12:45am
Originally posted by glassanza glassanza wrote:

I too agree with Catani regarding this issue, with more and more things aloft these days I would like the opportunity to see as many of them as possible.

Funny, but as I have debated the "ins and outs' of ADSB, I've kind of come full circle.

I really hate the fact that it is an incomplete solution in the US, the reasons for which I've stated before, ad nausea.

I've put 100 hours on my plane this year and always use Flight Following when VFR.  Last weekend I flew to a non-towered airport with a diner on the field for breakfast, just about 100 miles from my backyard private strip.  A very nice clear blue day with little to no haze. While in route ATC called out three aircraft that I never did see - I have a heck of time finding targets against a backdrop of planet earth - the higher ones, usually not a problem.  While there eating breakfast I saw many types of aircraft ranging from home built and Carbon Cubs through Bonanzas, coming and going.  I guess I was the only light twin that day.  On the way back home I didn't use FF but saw several aircraft approaching the airport as I was departing - most seemed to be making appropriate radio calls with position reports as far as ten miles out but the ones I actually saw were not until they were very close.  It's the ones you never see that make you nervous.

Well, I'm not sure what any of that means but I'm now pretty firmly in the camp of wanting any help I can get with traffic awareness - it sure would be nice if all aircraft operating from public use airports or in class E or greater airspace were required to be equipped with at least ADSB-out so I wouldn't feel like I was throwing money at an incomplete traffic awareness solution.  One thing last weekend proved to me was that it is in fact a crowded sky, even in the middle of nowhere at low altitudes. And for those that disagree or don't like to make radio calls at non-towered airports, check six Ivan! :)

  

 

  






Edited by Stiletto1 - 29 Nov 2017 at 12:52am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Timothy Nathan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 2017 at 2:56am
To hear such support for the UK CAA position is encouraging.

But those of us who have been duped and misled into spending money on Avidyne equipment will not benefit from this conspicuity revolution unless we write off that money and turn back to Garmin.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Catani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 2017 at 4:30am
Originally posted by Gring Gring wrote:

Quote I think every aircraft and drone should be required to have on board a box that responds to ADS-B and/or Mode C transponder interrogations.

I could not disagree with this statement more.
And that sentiment is exactly why ADS-B Out, or at least a Mode C transponder, needs to be made mandatory everywhere -- too many would opt out even if flying through dense NYC airspace.  As I said, the airspace we fly in is not private property, and unlike our bedrooms, we've no right to parade around in public butt naked at any altitude with no transponder of any kind, IMHO.

Edited by Catani - 29 Nov 2017 at 4:31am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oskrypuch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 2017 at 8:42am
There is a "nest" of gliders right beside one of the approach legs to our airport. They don't want to be tracked, as they often stray high into prohibited airspace (transponder req'd above 6000ft in that location) and into clouds. As a group, they are bad actors, and have an misguided attitude that they can go wherever they want.

I would dearly love for them to be required to equip with Mode C, so ATC could see them to provide warnings, and I could see them directly with my Avidyne TAS, and in any case it would likely reduce their transgressions.

The flurry of light unmanned low flying craft is a new growing problem.

* Orest



Edited by oskrypuch - 29 Nov 2017 at 9:10am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HenryM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 2017 at 10:25am
I initially didn't think there was all that much traffic out there. However, sinceI got my first ADS-B In device, I've changed my mind. Even though I know I don't see every single plane out there, I am aware of many more, some coming very close to me, because of ADS-B. I am in the camp that would like everyone to participate.

I also think everyone should have a working radio, at least a handheld one. I witnessed a near collision at a very busy local airport (before they added a control tower), because someone with a god given right to fly without talking on the radio decided to use the cross runway closer to his parking space rather than the fairly busy runway that also favored the wind. There are few airports near me that I think could justify not having communication with the rest of the people using that airport. Things are crowded enough that basic safety devices should be required.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote n7ifr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 2017 at 10:51pm
Originally posted by ddgates ddgates wrote:

Originally posted by chflyer chflyer wrote:

I stand by my statement. At the moment it's just vaporware. Until it's available to customers for installation and use, including software, it doesn't really exist in any way as a product that is of benefit to pilots.

The customer deliverable is a usable function, not a piece of hardware that can't be used because the package (i.e. product) hasn't been completed. That hardware has apparently been part of boxes for several years, so its presence doesn't really mean anything to customers. It might never be used and the finished product might never be released.



You are right, Vince on that score.  It is something less than an affirmation that this has been offered as a sales feature, and then not delivered in a reasonable time frame.


So,  yes it is "end of summer" and we are still hearing the same frustrating answers from Avidyne that all are beginning to sound like the same VaporWare promises.  

.  Development of Seattle Avionics competitive approach charts for our Avidyne "is not cost effective..." 

.  the TAS"A" promised software that helped to propell IFD Sales is probably VaporWare, as suggested.

. Avidyne resources thought better allocated on promised improvements for existing v10.2.1 may also be VaporWare

Campaign Promises run rampant - in all sectors!!

Tom W.


 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oskrypuch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 2017 at 11:44pm
TAS is way cool in many parts of the world, including for my mission profile, but it would be a much harder sell in the US these days.

But regardless, I really don't see any sales linkage between the TAS units (A or otherwise) and the IFDs, at all. You can get an A or G traffic unit combined with an IFD or GTN (ugh) unit. Makes no difference.

SA cannot provide navdata, only charts. Most folks don't use the chart subscription anyway. There are so many other things that would be better to spend time on, that would serve more people.

Without question the TAS-A release is way overdue, embarrassingly so. But it adds only a little to the function of the non-A TAS unit, so personally I'm not really fussing about it. 

I have no reason to think that 10.2.1 won't be released in the near term, but I am absolutely certain that projected dates will NOT be announced. We'll find out about it when it is available to dealers. And even without 10.2.1, my IFD remains a stellar unit, by far the best FMS/GPS available out there, so personally I'm not fussing much about that either.

Avidyne used to discuss project time lines and dates, and that was great, but a few folks gave them a black eye over slipping dates, and I don't blame them for clamming up now -- like the rest of the industry.

* Orest



Edited by oskrypuch - 29 Nov 2017 at 11:48pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stiletto1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2017 at 6:31am
Originally posted by oskrypuch oskrypuch wrote:


I have no reason to think that 10.2.1 won't be released in the near term, but I am absolutely certain that projected dates will NOT be announced. We'll find out about it when it is available to dealers. And even without 10.2.1, my IFD remains a stellar unit, by far the best FMS/GPS available out there, so personally I'm not fussing much about that either.

Avidyne used to discuss project time lines and dates, and that was great, but a few folks gave them a black eye over slipping dates, and I don't blame them for clamming up now -- like the rest of the industry.

* Orest


Do we even know what new features/enhancements are intended to be included in 10.2.1?

All this talk about projected time lines being missed is not unique to Avidyne.  G has the same problem - announces products like their new displays and autopilots in advance of STC/AML, announces future compatibility and feature enhancements in advance, and misses projected software update dates by many months as well. 

BUT - as someone going in for a major avionics install next month I can tell you the most frustrating thing about all of this to me is that A does not have nearly the level integration and capability in ADSB transponders that G has. 

My situation is problematic in that my limited stack height pretty much dictates that I go with a remote transponder or audio panel or both, if I want to incorporate everything in a single stack and not panel mount something down by my knees.

Avidyne's current ADSB solutions lack dual band in, require separate box installs, and there is no sign of a pending future solution that would require going back for a reinstall at some future date anyway - which all forces additional unnecessary expense and lost flight time IF something better from A actually comes along.  Couple that with the fact that their current remote ADSB offerings were produced by a company no longer in business, well, it just leaves me cold - what are they selling, new old stock that is basically orphaned as soon as it is installed?  Any other solution requires mixing and matching a competitors panel mount components, which in my case takes up too much valuable panel space.

AND, G's latest GTN software release has added VFR approaches with vertical guidance and they are planning to include the ability of assigning crossing altitudes at any waypoint with their next release.  And Orest, they have been showing off the fabled Boeing Banana!

Well, although SVS is entertaining and I would prefer the FMS of the IFD, I can get SVS on an IPad or Aspen display and upload and make flight plan changes from the IPad on the fly. 

So, Avidyne, I gotta tell ya, in lieu of the above all this is a tough sell for my situation.

Right now I'm leaning toward an audio panel from one or the other with either twin GTN650's and a remote GTX345R, or twin IFD440's with remote out and a Skytrax (then wait for a remote dual band in solution and reinstall), an Aspen PFD, and then hope for G,A, or STec to get my plane on an AML for a digital AP. No question it would be A equipment if they had a viable competitor to the 345R.

I guess I won't make a final decision on which way to go until the day I write the check.    




Edited by Stiletto1 - 30 Nov 2017 at 6:50am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Timothy Nathan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2017 at 7:22am
Originally posted by n7ifr n7ifr wrote:

we are still hearing the same frustrating answers from Avidyne...TAS"A" promised software that helped to propell IFD Sales is probably VaporWare,


Where have they written that? If they have, at least it’s closure and we know that we have to spend money on Garmin and can give up waiting on Avidyne.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HenryM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2017 at 8:36am
Is there a list of issues in 10.2.0 anywhere? Have any major bugs been reported? I haven’t run into anything, but I’d rather know now than be surprised at an inopportune time.

I was even ok with 10.1.x, but I went to 10.2 to play with SVS. Are any new features expected in 10.2.1?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oskrypuch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2017 at 9:10am
Originally posted by Stiletto1 Stiletto1 wrote:

....And Orest, they have been showing off the fabled Boeing Banana!


Yes, I think G read all my posts, and got to work.  :-(

In general G has been very busy adding IFD features into their boxes. The biggie differences that will likely never change though, is their inefficient MENU key based structure, that is heavily tied to the touchscreen alone. There is also the bizarre 650 input "keyboard".

Ironically, G users should be pretty thankful for A.
 
* Orest

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oskrypuch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2017 at 9:13am
Originally posted by HenryM HenryM wrote:

Is there a list of issues in 10.2.0 anywhere? Have any major bugs been reported?...

Nothing major that I'm aware of. 

The tea leaves suggest that 10.2.1 will have some minor bug fixes, with a sprinkling of some new features. (but that prediction plus a dollar, will get you a cup of coffee)

* Orest

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gring Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2017 at 9:59am
Originally posted by Stiletto1 Stiletto1 wrote:


Right now I'm leaning toward an audio panel from one or the other with either twin GTN650's and a remote GTX345R,


From my experience, I think the GTN650 is a horrible box.  The keyboard is terrible and the small display is not usable due to its size.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AviSimpson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2017 at 11:23am
Originally posted by oskrypuch oskrypuch wrote:


I have no reason to think that 10.2.1 won't be released in the near term, but I am absolutely certain that projected dates will NOT be announced. We'll find out about it when it is available to dealers. And even without 10.2.1, my IFD remains a stellar unit, by far the best FMS/GPS available out there, so personally I'm not fussing much about that either.

Avidyne used to discuss project time lines and dates, and that was great, but a few folks gave them a black eye over slipping dates, and I don't blame them for clamming up now -- like the rest of the industry.

* Orest

Spot on. Release 10.2.1 has been in the works for many months now. The only comment that I will make on it is that it is primarily a bug fix release. There might be a surprise or two in the release but if you aren't seeing issues with the IFDs at 10.2, then there won't be much incentive to update to this release. A feature/fix list and timeline for availability will not be made public until the approval is received from the FAA.

Originally posted by Stiletto1 Stiletto1 wrote:

BUT - as someone going in for a major avionics install next month I can tell you the most frustrating thing about all of this to me is that A does not have nearly the level integration and capability in ADSB transponders that G has. 
I wouldn't say that's true. We support the GTX330ES, GTX335, GTX345, Appareo ES and our 2 transponders for ADS-B Out. We support GTX345, L3 Lynx and our ADS-B receivers for ADS-B In. We are planning to add to the list of products we integrate to in a future release, so that list will only grow.
Originally posted by Stiletto1 Stiletto1 wrote:

Avidyne's current ADSB solutions lack dual band in, require separate box installs, and there is no sign of a pending future solution that would require going back for a reinstall at some future date anyway - which all forces additional unnecessary expense and lost flight time IF something better from A actually comes along.  Couple that with the fact that their current remote ADSB offerings were produced by a company no longer in business, well, it just leaves me cold - what are they selling, new old stock that is basically orphaned as soon as it is installed?  Any other solution requires mixing and matching a competitors panel mount components, which in my case takes up too much valuable panel space.
Agreed. That's why we are taking a multiprong attack on supporting as many ADS-B products and developing our own ADS-B products (TAS-A and others). 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stiletto1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2017 at 1:07pm
Originally posted by oskrypuch oskrypuch wrote:

Originally posted by Stiletto1 Stiletto1 wrote:

....And Orest, they have been showing off the fabled Boeing Banana!


Yes, I think G read all my posts, and got to work.  :-(

In general G has been very busy adding IFD features into their boxes. The biggie differences that will likely never change though, is their inefficient MENU key based structure, that is heavily tied to the touchscreen alone. There is also the bizarre 650 input "keyboard".

Ironically, G users should be pretty thankful for A.
 
* Orest


I agree with everything you say, thus my quandary in choosing which way to go.

However, that clunky interface is alleviated somewhat when you add the ability to upload and make flight plan changes with an IPad - which is something I've become accustomed to already.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stiletto1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2017 at 1:12pm
Originally posted by Gring Gring wrote:

Originally posted by Stiletto1 Stiletto1 wrote:


Right now I'm leaning toward an audio panel from one or the other with either twin GTN650's and a remote GTX345R,


From my experience, I think the GTN650 is a horrible box.  The keyboard is terrible and the small display is not usable due to its size.

Agreed.  One might say the same thing about the IFD440 screen size - However, when you add a PFD and an IPad in the mix you have the ability to do all your flight planning in advance, upload, and make changes on the fly without ever touching the navigator, and you have more screen real estate than the IFD 550/540 or even a GTN750 - so, I'm not sure that really matters too much.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stiletto1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2017 at 1:23pm
Originally posted by AviSimpson AviSimpson wrote:


Originally posted by Stiletto1 Stiletto1 wrote:

BUT - as someone going in for a major avionics install next month I can tell you the most frustrating thing about all of this to me is that A does not have nearly the level integration and capability in ADSB transponders that G has. 
I wouldn't say that's true. We support the GTX330ES, GTX335, GTX345, Appareo ES and our 2 transponders for ADS-B Out. We support GTX345, L3 Lynx and our ADS-B receivers for ADS-B In. We are planning to add to the list of products we integrate to in a future release, so that list will only grow.
Originally posted by Stiletto1 Stiletto1 wrote:

Avidyne's current ADSB solutions lack dual band in, require separate box installs, and there is no sign of a pending future solution that would require going back for a reinstall at some future date anyway - which all forces additional unnecessary expense and lost flight time IF something better from A actually comes along.  Couple that with the fact that their current remote ADSB offerings were produced by a company no longer in business, well, it just leaves me cold - what are they selling, new old stock that is basically orphaned as soon as it is installed?  Any other solution requires mixing and matching a competitors panel mount components, which in my case takes up too much valuable panel space.
Agreed. That's why we are taking a multiprong attack on supporting as many ADS-B products and developing our own ADS-B products (TAS-A and others). 

I appreciate your position.  As I said my case is problematic due to lack of enough radio stack height to include a panel mount transponder (I don't really want to put a panel mount one down by my knees) - so, my preference is for a remote dual band in transponder solution like the GTX345R - which unfortunately is not supported with an IFD.  If Avidyne had a similar box available I would not be hesitating.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chflyer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2017 at 1:24pm
Originally posted by HenryM HenryM wrote:

Is there a list of issues in 10.2.0 anywhere? Have any major bugs been reported? I haven’t run into anything, but I’d rather know now than be surprised at an inopportune time.

I was even ok with 10.1.x, but I went to 10.2 to play with SVS. Are any new features expected in 10.2.1?

I don't recall any mention of additional features with 10.2.1. Normally a 3rd point release is pure maintenance.

The big 10.2.1 fix that I'm waiting for (and holding out on 10.2.0) is the user waypoint deletion problem. I have many many user waypoints and will need to reenter them manually when moving to 10.2.x. I only want to do that once.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Timothy Nathan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2017 at 7:06pm
Originally posted by AviSimpson AviSimpson wrote:

We support GTX345....for ADS-B In.

So, is that now the recommendation?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote n7ifr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Dec 2017 at 11:47am
Vince,

I gave up on the wait, so my solution has been to keep my Wpts on the PC Sim where I have been able to restore them to the panel 540's.

If you have dual panel units, restore from two separate USB drives, or turn off one while restoring to one, then reverse Off the other...

Yes, it has been a long wait - seems like a forgotton cause, along with the TAS "A" update promised fix.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chflyer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Dec 2017 at 6:31pm
Tom,

I assume you mean that you have entered them (manually?) on the new (10.2 compatible) sim.

In any case, I was forced to migrate due to a repair to one IFD (which always comes with the latest version .... hence 10.2). Of course I had to update the 2nd IFD to 10.2 too so that the two could talk.

I guess I just got lucky, because the update from 10.1.3.0 to 10.2.0.0 didn't erase my user wpts. My first action under 10.2 when I saw the user wpts still there was to do a backup to usb, even before sync'ing the two IFDs. So I now have a 10.2 usr wpt backup just in case the issue fixed by 10.2.1 raises its head. 


Edited by chflyer - 31 Dec 2017 at 6:32pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ddgates Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jan 2018 at 12:55pm
Just observing that this thread (about TAS-A) was started 2 1/2 years ago!!!

The product was overdue at that time!!!


Edited by ddgates - 01 Jan 2018 at 12:56pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote n7ifr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 11:09am
"End of Summer..." and "end of 4th QTR"!!  Promises, promises...

Lets see, are we still stuck in the mud...

. TAS"A" Software update to integrate 1090 ADSB IN
. v10.2.1 to allow IFD X40 high speed baud comm with Aspen/Lynx + other needed fixes

Happy New Year David.  Lets go flying.

Tom W.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ddgates Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 11:31am
Originally posted by n7ifr n7ifr wrote:

Happy New Year David.  Lets go flying.

Tom W.

Tom:

Bonanza completes annual today.  Walk through on Carefree house tomorrow.

David
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote n7ifr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jan 2018 at 3:21pm
Congrats David, on both.
Up in Pagosa Springs until next week, driving down Monday - in total withdrawal from plane, so hoping to get back to lots of flying.

Tom
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Timothy Nathan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jan 2018 at 1:36pm
So this thread is now so old and useless that we are going to use it to discuss our travel plans?

I have managed to talk two, maybe three, people out of IFDs this week.  Avidyne may have forgotten their side of the bargain, I haven't forgotten mine.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gring Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jan 2018 at 3:19pm
Tim, you must feel pretty proud of yourself!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Timothy Nathan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jan 2018 at 3:20pm
Not proud, just fulfilling my end of the bargain.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Timothy Nathan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jan 2018 at 3:50pm
But, Gring, on a more positive, and rather eery, note, literally at the same moment that your message popped up, I was watching a Ted talk which mentioned Kingston, NY!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LANCE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jan 2018 at 6:42pm
Originally posted by Timothy Nathan Timothy Nathan wrote:

So this thread is now so old and useless that we are going to use it to discuss our travel plans?

I have managed to talk two, maybe three, people out of IFDs this week.  Avidyne may have forgotten their side of the bargain, I haven't forgotten mine.

Griping and complaining and talking negatively to others about Avidyne isn't going to make any more traffic display on your unit. This forum is for people that enjoy the benefits of their Avidynes and are looking forward to even more features to come - in other words generally positive people. None of us want to hear you air your grievances. That would be best be done will e-mails directly to Avidyne or pay them a visit in person if you want, but please not here. We really don't want to hear it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote n7ifr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jan 2018 at 7:33pm
[/QUOTE]

Griping and complaining and talking negatively to others about Avidyne isn't going to make any more traffic display on your unit. This forum is for people that enjoy the benefits of their Avidynes and are looking forward to even more features to come - in other words generally positive people. None of us want to hear you air your grievances. That would be best be done will e-mails directly to Avidyne or pay them a visit in person if you want, but please not here. We really don't want to hear it.
[/QUOTE]

Don't shoot the messenger - Many Avidyne customers have bought into Avidyne products not only for the quality, but also for the advertised promises of time-sensitive future development... 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Timothy Nathan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jan 2018 at 3:23am
Lance,

You must be blessed with tremendous insight to know what literally everyone else is thinking. Kudos.

But is this really just a fanboi’s meeting place? A cathedral built to the praise of Avidyne? If so, what would happen if the Emperor really had no clothes?

We must open our minds to other perspectives, should we not?

And I will open mine to yours. How, in your opinion, will I best behave to get what I paid for four years ago in, let’s say, the next year, before the fifth anniversary of their six month promise?

Emails, you say? Jumping on a jet plane and crossing the Atlantic? Are these techniques guaranteed success? Tell you what, if you pay for my flight and hotel I promise to repay you (at some unspecified time in the future) if I leave the factory with a working 605A certified for ADS-B in. Seem reasonable?   You trust me the way I trusted Avidyne, right?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oskrypuch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jan 2018 at 9:42am
There really isn't anything new to say on this. Folks, let's not feed the troll.

* Orest



Edited by oskrypuch - 14 Jan 2018 at 9:43am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Timothy Nathan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jan 2018 at 9:56am
Originally posted by oskrypuch oskrypuch wrote:

There really isn't anything new to say on this.


And that is just what they should be ashamed of. I am honestly amazed and bewildered by your corporate willingness to take it lying down.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote brou0040 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jan 2018 at 12:05pm
Originally posted by n7ifr n7ifr wrote:

Originally posted by LANCE LANCE wrote:


Griping and complaining and talking negatively to others about Avidyne isn't going to make any more traffic display on your unit. This forum is for people that enjoy the benefits of their Avidynes and are looking forward to even more features to come - in other words generally positive people. None of us want to hear you air your grievances. That would be best be done will e-mails directly to Avidyne or pay them a visit in person if you want, but please not here. We really don't want to hear it.

Don't shoot the messenger - Many Avidyne customers have bought into Avidyne products not only for the quality, but also for the advertised promises of time-sensitive future development... 

T. Wolf

I agree, Avidyne has failed on promises multiple times.  The extent of their issues cannot be blamed on the FAA, which they repeatedly do as an excuse for their failure to execute.  Many of the Avidyne supporters cite this forum as a positive interaction with Avidyne that other manufacturers don't have.  That doesn't mean this is a fanboy only forum.  If this forum was just to pat backs and give high fives, it would not be providing useful customer feedback to Avidyne - not all customer feedback is positive.

Understandably, Avidyne has stopped providing promised dates - which was one of their marketing flaws in the past, but unfortunately, they've more or less shut down all communications, which has generated much of the frustration.


Edited by brou0040 - 15 Jan 2018 at 12:07pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pburger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jan 2018 at 12:27pm
Originally posted by brou0040 brou0040 wrote:

I agree, Avidyne has failed on promises multiple times.  The extent of their issues cannot be blamed on the FAA, which they repeatedly do as an excuse for their failure to execute.  Many of the Avidyne supporters cite this forum as a positive interaction with Avidyne that other manufacturers don't have.  That doesn't mean this is a fanboy only forum.  If this forum was just to pat backs and give high fives, it would not be providing useful customer feedback to Avidyne - not all customer feedback is positive.

Understandably, Avidyne has stopped providing promised dates - which was one of their marketing flaws in the past, but unfortunately, they've more or less shut down all communications, which has generated much of the frustration.

Well said.  I am constantly amazed at the fanboy defense of Avidyne at all turns by a few members.  It reminds me a lot of Apple fanboys.  The truth is that Avidyne is not perfect.  They have made some missteps.  They need to hear the negative feedback.  In fact, I believe that negative feedback is much more valuable than positive feedback.  That being said, I am still an Avidyne fan.  I want Avidyne to succeed, and I love to show off my cool Avidyne stack to my friends.

The very existence of this forum is a testament to Avidyne's willingness to engage with their customers, and at least for now, that includes both negative and positive feedback, and I applaud them for that.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote glassanza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jan 2018 at 6:44pm
I kind of have to agree with Timothy on this one. Since this issues has roused the “senior counsel” to reply to this thread let’s not forget about the repeated whining about pushed release dates for the IFD’s which was virtually unanimous among pre-buyer customers (Oskrypuch excluded). During that time Steve took the heat and answered the hard questions honestly which at least provided some assurance of Avidyne’s commitment to deliver. I realize that this forum has become more of an education tool for new owners trying to figure out how to get north up on the map page but there are other Avidyne products that appear to have not received the same priority the IFD’s did. For my sake I hope the IFD’s remain a flagship for Avidyne so additional features continue to be developed. That being said, for those who paid good money for pre-buy product s 4 year ago that still have nothing to show for it I can totally understand their contempt for Avidyne at this point. With regard to this thread I believe Steve offered Timothy a refund of his deposit quite some time ago ( I could be wrong, this battle has been going on for a while), maybe that is still available and it is time to move on to what I would think would be better and cheaper options at this point. Just my opinion, not my money.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Timothy Nathan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jan 2018 at 7:03pm
Originally posted by glassanza glassanza wrote:

Steve offered Timothy a refund of his deposit quite some time ago ( I could be wrong, this battle has been going on for a while), maybe that is still available and it is time to move on to what I would think would be better and cheaper options at this point. Just my opinion, not my money.  

Not really, no.

The position is much more nuanced than that.  I am going to use made up numbers, but they are not far wrong.  Although £1 ~ $1.35, in your heads you can just treat the £ sign as a $ sign, because this is roughly the equivalent (flying is much more expensive over here.)

I wanted TAS + ADS-B In.  My avionics shop offered me two choices:
  1. You can have Garmin, fully working, installed now and it's going to be (say) £22k
  2. You can have Avidyne.  TAS works now but you get a voucher for ADS-B when it comes out in a few months.  I trust Avidyne to deliver.  That's going to be (say) £15k.
I (foolishly, as I now recognise) believed Avidyne and paid the £15k

About two years ago, once Avidyne realised how much business I was costing them (actually, I think that they still have no idea how much business I am costing them, it is huge) they called me and offered me £2k.

At the time, the GTX 345 was not available, so the cost of getting ADS-B In would have been around £22k, less whatever I could have sold the TAS605 for, maybe £5k.  £17K is more than £2k, by quite a margin, so the offer made no sense.

Now we have the GTX 345, which costs about £5k, I think.  I have it installed in the "other" aircraft and it works very nicely.  I guess it would cost £1k to install and certify, so £6k in all.  More attractive, but still three times the £2k offer.

So I would not use the word "refund".  I never paid £2k.  It is a notional amount as far as I am concerned and comes nowhere near covering my costs.  They would have to offer to pay to have a GTX 345 installed to make me shut up and go away, and I am confident that that ain't going to happen!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote glassanza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jan 2018 at 7:30pm
So you actually paid Avidyne $15k (not adjusted, understand that) and got offered $2k to cancel your pre-buy which 4 years later is still not available to install in your aircraft? Based on your outlay and timeframe to not receive a certified product I see your point. Flushing $13k doesn’t set too well with anyone now matter what side of the pond you are on.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LANCE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jan 2018 at 12:45am
Originally posted by Timothy Nathan Timothy Nathan wrote:

They would have to offer to pay to have a GTX 345 installed to make me shut up and go away, and I am confident that that ain't going to happen!

If we all got up a collection, what would we have to pay to make you go away from the forum?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Timothy Nathan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jan 2018 at 3:21am
There seems a great ease with which some people claim to speak for everyone, which, judging by the balance of discussion, is not justified.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote brou0040 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jan 2018 at 10:37am
Originally posted by LANCE LANCE wrote:

Originally posted by Timothy Nathan Timothy Nathan wrote:

They would have to offer to pay to have a GTX 345 installed to make me shut up and go away, and I am confident that that ain't going to happen!

If we all got up a collection, what would we have to pay to make you go away from the forum?

Leave him alone, your whining about him is just as annoying.  If you don't like it, stop visiting this page!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote glassanza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jan 2018 at 1:41pm
Actually the chatter on the forum has been pretty flat lately, thought I would give him an opportunity to provide some entertainment until we get a new IFD release to talk about. I am familiar with his history in this thread and understand why most of tired of hearing from him. Last comment from me on this.
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