Avidyne Homepage
Forum Home Forum Home > Avidyne General > IFD 5 Series & IFD 4 Series Touch Screen GPS/NAV/COM
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Dual IFD Techniques
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login

Dual IFD Techniques
 Post Reply Post Reply
Author
Message
  Topic Search Topic Search  Topic Options Topic Options
AviJake View Drop Down
Admin Group
Admin Group


Joined: 26 Mar 2009
Location: Lincoln MA
Status: Offline
Points: 2815 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AviJake Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Dual IFD Techniques
    Posted: 02 Jan 2014 at 9:34am
Thought I'd share some personal techniques for those aircraft planning on equipping with dual IFDs.  These techniques apply equally well to 540-540, 540-440 and 440-440 combos.  Of course, these are just techniques and not procedure.

I hope and bet once these are fielded, a lot of folks will pipe in with their techniques and preferences so we can all potentially benefit.

That being said, after many months of frequent IFD flying with dual IFD540s, my preferences have boiled down to:

  • Both IFDs set to CrossSync meaning they share data back and forth
  • Top IFD set to Keyboard Convenience mode - this means that when operating the top IFD in a way that would have normally produced a virtual keyboard onscreen, the keyboard appears on the lower IFD instead.  This keeps the top display uncluttered by a keyboard.
  • Top IFD has Terrain Awareness (TA) turned off.  This prevents a lot of red and yellow alerting depictions from displaying on the map of the top IFD.  I do this so I don't have that display provide alerts on nominal takeoffs and landings.  I still have FLTA (Forward Looking Terrain Alerting) running.  I take off with the top IFD set to map and don't want to see terrain awareness red and yellow on take off leg and approach to landing.  I keep TA on the lower IFD turned on however.
  • Top IFD set to traffic thumbnail depiction and bottom IFD set to factory defaults for the left edge set of datablocks.  By doing that to the top IFD, I also get a 3rd com freq slot displayed that I use all the time.
  • Top IFD map orientation set to North Up, 360 view and lower IFD map orientation set to Track/Heading Up and Arc view
  • Ensure both IFDs use the same FLTA aural alert choices.  You are allowed to have two different aurals for terrain/obstacle warnings and cautions via reg but I find that sub-optimal
  • Top IFD set to datalink lightning as the source and bottom IFD set to sensor (TWX or WX500) lightning as the source
  • Top IFD use factory default right side datablock selections and lower IFD change those selections to include ETE to Destination, Wind Vector, Local Time and Flight Timer.
  • I have GPS AGL Altitude set as a top strip datablock option on both IFDs.  I like to set VSR as a top strip datablock selection on the lower IFD too.
  • During approaches, I set top IFD to Map-Data split view and lower IFD to Chart page.  Because of the datablock selections that come on the top IFD, I always know distance to run to next approach waypoint and to the airfield I'm heading for (e.g. 2.5 nm to FAF and 7.0 nm to landing)

  • Personally, I don't find myself using the Wx Overlay selection often to intentionally mix up the datalink products on the two IFDs.  I thought that would be helpful (e.g. METARS on lower IFD only, Nexrad on upper IFD only, Icing on upper IFD only, Winds on lower IFD only, etc) but operationally, I haven't felt too compelled to do so.   Info junkies may love that feature however.
Steve Jacobson
sjacobson@avidyne.com
Back to Top
edanford View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: 21 Nov 2011
Location: Austin Tx
Status: Offline
Points: 116 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote edanford Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jan 2014 at 11:15am
Thanks Steve,  For those of us with a single IFD540 can you share your set up preferences for that configuration too?  

Ed
Ed
Back to Top
Gring View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member


Joined: 30 Dec 2011
Location: Kingston, NY
Status: Offline
Points: 720 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gring Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jan 2014 at 8:46am

I posted this in the Draft Pilot Gude thread a few weeks ago, but thought it should be moved over here.  I went through the setup chapter of the IFD guide and began to think about how I might like to setup a dual IFD540 setup in my aircraft which has traditional steam gauges.  I think Steve and crew have done an outstanding job at providing configuration flexibility.  I used a screen capture tool to cut and paste various images from the pilot guide into an Excel spreadsheet to give me an idea of what it might look like.  I'm super pleased. 

Here is what I came up as a first attempt. 
 
 


Edited by Gring - 05 Jan 2014 at 7:00pm
Back to Top
Gring View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member


Joined: 30 Dec 2011
Location: Kingston, NY
Status: Offline
Points: 720 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gring Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Mar 2014 at 8:24am
I've now spent some time in the pilot program with a Dual IFD setup and thought I'd post my technique and comments along with why I've chosen to do things this way.  I have gone through and changed many of the user settings to get the unit configured to my liking
 
My airplane has traditional steam gauges with a King KFC200 AP/Flight Director and HSI setup.  It has JPI fuel flow, on board weather, active traffic, lightning detection.  If I had a PFD I would change the left side datablock on the top IFD to replace the current info with the traffic thumbnail and 3rd comm since I would have all of the current information on the PFD.
 
My radio stack is right of center enough that it requires an external ennuciator.  If you have the choice, I would mount it as close to you as practical.  I am considering modifying the panel to move one of the IFDs to the center where the engine gauges are now.  I'm also older and now require reading glasses with my contacts, so that may factor into some of my decisions.
 
I tend to be a KISS kind of guy so I don't usually want to look at a lot of clutter on the screens.  That said, I use the top IFD in track up arc mode with a 10-15nm range while the bottom IFD I have on North up at a 40nm range.  The top IFD has Nexrad weather, FLTA, and keyboard convienence on.  I have swapped back and forth on having the TA on and off.  I can't decide.  If I had a PFD with SV, then I would for sure have it off (redundant to the PFD).  The bottom IFD has Lightning sensor on. and both display traffic including N-numbers.  This gives me one IFD that is my primary navigation system that shows me tactically where I am going and a second IFD that gives me situational awareness (oriented North) and is my data entry box for flight plans, charting, etc.
 
The top IFD has auto switching of VORs on which is useful when flying an ILS approach.  The bottom IFD does not have this turned on because  I generally set the second VOR to a crossing radial as I'm flying cross country and so I need to be able to manually control it.
 
I have not played with adding additional com channels on the screen.  I use the top two for in air frequencies (tower, ctaf, approach, departure) and the bottom two for ground based frequencies (clearance, ground, atis).  I've always done it this way and it has worked well.  However, when I put a PFD in, I'll probably use the standard traffic datablock setup with the 3rd com frequency on the top IFD as I can see some benefit for it.  As an aside note, I have my top antenna connected to the bottom IFD to better communicate with ground stations, and the belly mounted antenna connected to the top IFD for when I'm in the air communicating with ground based stations.  This seems to work very well.
 
I spent a lot of time on the MAP setup screen and which layer has what information.  Although I fly a lot of IFR, I don't really want to be looking at airway routes, waypoint fixes cluttering up the screen, however, I do want the option to see them.  I generally have the map in the middle nav priority.  I set the highest nav priority with airways and waypoints, but turned them off on the middle nav priority.  I like to see all of the airspace around me, so that is on for all airspace without any altitude filters.  I show all airports since I land at grass strips as well as towered Class B airports.  I show lables on most things on the screen, but remember, I don't have a lot of things on my screen.  On the land overlay, I removed most of the stuff except for terrain features.  As I write this, I can't remember if there is a way to display state boundaries and will have to check on that on today's flight.  I would turn that on.
 
I come from a G430 / MFD environment, so I always had the 430 in the CDI scale mode where I had the 6 datablocks.  I guess I didn't realize how much I used the TRK over DTK and the CDI scale when flying.  I've tried a few different things to get the IFD to operate similarly and have been rethinking how best to use this information.  No conclusion yet, other than a PFD would eliminate this issue for me.
 
The top IFD right side datablocks are configured with waypoint time / distance / Trk information. with VSR and Minimum Safe Altitude, again tacitcal - where am I going.  The bottom IFD has a mixture of information - Nearest airport, times, fuel and alarm count.  I tend to fly with the data blocks hidden and only expand them when I want to know about something.  Again, a PFD would have the next waypoint info on it, minimizing the need to expand the datablock.
 
On approaches I follow what Steve does which is to have the top IFD on map mode and the bottom IFD on Chart mode.  I have turned the charts to day mode which is my preference and seems to work well at night.  I also spent a lot of time with the lighting settings in maintenance mode to get the dimbus and photocell to work for me.
 
Note, the picture below is in the hangar with no GPS signal, so the Top IFD defaults to the track up mode.
 


Edited by Gring - 23 Mar 2014 at 8:27am
Back to Top
twalterhome3 View Drop Down
Groupie
Groupie


Joined: 06 Sep 2012
Location: CA
Status: Offline
Points: 43 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote twalterhome3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Mar 2014 at 2:35pm
Originally posted by Gring Gring wrote:

I've now spent some time in the pilot program with a Dual IFD setup and thought I'd post my technique and comments along with why I've chosen to do things this way.  I have gone through and changed many of the user settings to get the unit configured to my liking
 
My airplane has traditional steam gauges with a King KFC200 AP/Flight Director and HSI setup.  It has JPI fuel flow, on board weather, active traffic, lightning detection.  If I had a PFD I would change the left side datablock on the top IFD to replace the current info with the traffic thumbnail and 3rd comm since I would have all of the current information on the PFD.
 
My radio stack is right of center enough that it requires an external ennuciator.  If you have the choice, I would mount it as close to you as practical.  I am considering modifying the panel to move one of the IFDs to the center where the engine gauges are now.  I'm also older and now require reading glasses with my contacts, so that may factor into some of my decisions.
 
I tend to be a KISS kind of guy so I don't usually want to look at a lot of clutter on the screens.  That said, I use the top IFD in track up arc mode with a 10-15nm range while the bottom IFD I have on North up at a 40nm range.  The top IFD has Nexrad weather, FLTA, and keyboard convienence on.  I have swapped back and forth on having the TA on and off.  I can't decide.  If I had a PFD with SV, then I would for sure have it off (redundant to the PFD).  The bottom IFD has Lightning sensor on. and both display traffic including N-numbers.  This gives me one IFD that is my primary navigation system that shows me tactically where I am going and a second IFD that gives me situational awareness (oriented North) and is my data entry box for flight plans, charting, etc.
 
The top IFD has auto switching of VORs on which is useful when flying an ILS approach.  The bottom IFD does not have this turned on because  I generally set the second VOR to a crossing radial as I'm flying cross country and so I need to be able to manually control it.
 
I have not played with adding additional com channels on the screen.  I use the top two for in air frequencies (tower, ctaf, approach, departure) and the bottom two for ground based frequencies (clearance, ground, atis).  I've always done it this way and it has worked well.  However, when I put a PFD in, I'll probably use the standard traffic datablock setup with the 3rd com frequency on the top IFD as I can see some benefit for it.  As an aside note, I have my top antenna connected to the bottom IFD to better communicate with ground stations, and the belly mounted antenna connected to the top IFD for when I'm in the air communicating with ground based stations.  This seems to work very well.
 
I spent a lot of time on the MAP setup screen and which layer has what information.  Although I fly a lot of IFR, I don't really want to be looking at airway routes, waypoint fixes cluttering up the screen, however, I do want the option to see them.  I generally have the map in the middle nav priority.  I set the highest nav priority with airways and waypoints, but turned them off on the middle nav priority.  I like to see all of the airspace around me, so that is on for all airspace without any altitude filters.  I show all airports since I land at grass strips as well as towered Class B airports.  I show lables on most things on the screen, but remember, I don't have a lot of things on my screen.  On the land overlay, I removed most of the stuff except for terrain features.  As I write this, I can't remember if there is a way to display state boundaries and will have to check on that on today's flight.  I would turn that on.
 
I come from a G430 / MFD environment, so I always had the 430 in the CDI scale mode where I had the 6 datablocks.  I guess I didn't realize how much I used the TRK over DTK and the CDI scale when flying.  I've tried a few different things to get the IFD to operate similarly and have been rethinking how best to use this information.  No conclusion yet, other than a PFD would eliminate this issue for me.
 
The top IFD right side datablocks are configured with waypoint time / distance / Trk information. with VSR and Minimum Safe Altitude, again tacitcal - where am I going.  The bottom IFD has a mixture of information - Nearest airport, times, fuel and alarm count.  I tend to fly with the data blocks hidden and only expand them when I want to know about something.  Again, a PFD would have the next waypoint info on it, minimizing the need to expand the datablock.
 
On approaches I follow what Steve does which is to have the top IFD on map mode and the bottom IFD on Chart mode.  I have turned the charts to day mode which is my preference and seems to work well at night.  I also spent a lot of time with the lighting settings in maintenance mode to get the dimbus and photocell to work for me.
 
Note, the picture below is in the hangar with no GPS signal, so the Top IFD defaults to the track up mode.
 

Great Pirep !
thanks !
Tim
Back to Top
MikeK View Drop Down
Groupie
Groupie


Joined: 16 Sep 2013
Status: Offline
Points: 87 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MikeK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Mar 2014 at 3:04pm
Thanks for the report!

On both your IFDs, there's a box at the top with a red X.  What usually goes there?

Also, I notice that there's no decoded name under your comm frequencies.  Is this because you didn't have a GPS fix, and so it can't be sure which facility you're near?
Back to Top
Gring View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member


Joined: 30 Dec 2011
Location: Kingston, NY
Status: Offline
Points: 720 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gring Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Mar 2014 at 3:39pm

When the IFDs have a GPS fix, the Red X disappears and is replaced by the ground track, and the frequency is also decoded appropriately.  In my case, it would say "Kingston Ulster" and I still have a Garmin GMX-340 audio panel with no noticed compatibility issues.



Edited by Gring - 25 Mar 2014 at 3:41pm
Back to Top
MikeK View Drop Down
Groupie
Groupie


Joined: 16 Sep 2013
Status: Offline
Points: 87 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MikeK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Mar 2014 at 3:41pm
Ah, ground track.  Cool, thanks.

I am sure looking forward to receiving mine!  I'm glad we were able to re-engineer my panel to take a 540 instead of the originally planned 440.
Back to Top
roy32jm View Drop Down
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: 06 Nov 2014
Status: Offline
Points: 18 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote roy32jm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 2014 at 9:24pm

Steve,

Is this the screen configuration you used in combination with a G500? I am installing a G500 dual 540 system in place of KFC200, HSI... and 530. This will be a big change so looking for lots of guidance.
be on time, do what you say, finish what you start, say please and thank you
Back to Top
Gring View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member


Joined: 30 Dec 2011
Location: Kingston, NY
Status: Offline
Points: 720 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gring Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Nov 2014 at 6:31am
Roy, the display technique above is working with a 6 pack. For a G500 setup, I would run the standard setup with 3 freq boxes and the traffic box (assuming you have traffic) on the top IFD because the G500 will have GS, GPS mode, a CDI scale, DTK and TRK already. This would be a good start, the you can add and change info as it suits you.
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 12.01
Copyright ©2001-2018 Web Wiz Ltd.

This page was generated in 0.109 seconds.