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Time to renew my nav/data plan....

Printed From: Avidyne
Category: Avidyne General
Forum Name: IFD 5 Series & IFD 4 Series Touch Screen GPS/NAV/COM
Forum Description: Topics on Avidyne's IFD 5 Series and IFD 4 Series Touch Screen GPS/NAV/COM
URL: http://forums.avidyne.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=1718
Printed Date: 10 Jul 2020 at 3:11pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.01 - http://www.webwizforums.com


Topic: Time to renew my nav/data plan....
Posted By: GBSoren71965
Subject: Time to renew my nav/data plan....
Date Posted: 02 Apr 2019 at 6:58am
I just got my renewal invoice from Jep, it's going up about $100 from last year. I have an IFD440 and do the bundle so I can get data for the IFD100, it'll now be right at $700 for the year. That's without charts! Sure wish I could get Geo-ref charts on my IFD100 with this, I could then at least eliminate Garmin Pilot.

Does any know if Jep does discounts at Sun n Fun? 



Replies:
Posted By: teeth6
Date Posted: 02 Apr 2019 at 7:01am
I believe there is a $50 discount at any airshow that Jepp attends.


Posted By: Bob H
Date Posted: 02 Apr 2019 at 8:50am
What coverage area do you subscribe to?

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Bob


Posted By: GBSoren71965
Date Posted: 02 Apr 2019 at 3:07pm
Full USA


Posted By: CubedRoot
Date Posted: 03 Apr 2019 at 4:56pm
I just got my quote as well... except it was for about $1300!!!! I have an IFD540.  




Posted By: George P
Date Posted: 03 Apr 2019 at 6:23pm
Why so much?  I just paid my subscription and it was $491 for US coverage.  Are you getting approach charts too?


Posted By: CubedRoot
Date Posted: 03 Apr 2019 at 6:33pm
Originally posted by George P George P wrote:

Why so much?  I just paid my subscription and it was $491 for US coverage.  Are you getting approach charts too?

I have no freaking clue, and this is why I ABSOLUTELY HATE that we have to use Jeppessen for this stuff.  I have no idea what I am getting with these jerks, and have no idea what I even need.   When I called them, I told them I had an IFD540 and she said this was all they had available and that was the price.  

Jeppessen are absolute scumbags when it comes to this sort of stuff.

Here is a photo of the invoice they sent me a couple days ago:
http://photos.app.goo.gl/FeqaLhZ41f4rrx2g7" rel="nofollow -
http://photos.app.goo.gl/FeqaLhZ41f4rrx2g7" rel="nofollow - https://photos.app.goo.gl/FeqaLhZ41f4rrx2g7


Posted By: George P
Date Posted: 03 Apr 2019 at 6:49pm
I just looked at my invoice.  It shows:

Revision Service 28 days annual
NavData.IFR.Coverage.Avidyne.IFD540 Full USA
30 Apr. 19 through 30 Apr. 20

It is Item Number 10502544, Price $491

I do not get the Jeppesen approach charts for the IFD540 as I find them pretty useless on the small IFD540 screen.  I use NOS charts from Foreflight which are georeferenced and a readable size on my IPad.  I suppose I would prefer Jeppesen charts but the cost is prohibitive.  I agree that Jeppesen customer service is abysmal.  Wish there was an alternative.


Posted By: GBSoren71965
Date Posted: 04 Apr 2019 at 6:41am
Mine is the nav/obsticle IFD440 bundle. I think you can only get data on the IFD100 by doing the "bundle". 
I would actually like to get updated charts on the IFD100, then I wouldn't have to go between the IFD100 and Flyq to see my charts. My charts on my IFD100 app are out of date and have the not for navigation watermark on them.


Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: 05 Apr 2019 at 6:12pm
I am also frustrated with the cost of Jepps. What would it take for Avidyne modify the software to be able use NACO data form Seattle Avionics?


Posted By: Flybuddy
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2019 at 7:13pm
I'm new to the IFDs and looked up Jepp while I was at SunNFun. Their computers were down and they really couldn't tell me anything. I had heard we get 2 free months with the IFD purchase but Jepp folks didn't know that nor could they quote me a subscription price. You would think that's pretty basic stuff.


Posted By: AviSteve
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2019 at 7:24pm
Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

I am also frustrated with the cost of Jepps. What would it take for Avidyne modify the software to be able use NACO data form Seattle Avionics?
It's a much bigger job than you would think.  We have other more important stuff to be working on - like RF legs - right Vince (chflyer)?


-------------
Steve Lindsley
Avidyne Engineering


Posted By: Craig767
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2019 at 9:29pm
I updated at Sun n Fun. The guy that helped me was not too knowledgeable but determined that there is now a IFD 540 bundle with nav and obstacles. Priced both 440 bundle and 540 bundle. Both were $685.
Which is a $95 increase from last year. Savings at Sun n Fun was two additional months.
I believe that the $491 price is for nav data only, may have to go back to that if they keep increasing the bundle price.

Craig


Posted By: CubedRoot
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2019 at 9:43pm
Originally posted by Craig767 Craig767 wrote:

I updated at Sun n Fun. The guy that helped me was not too knowledgeable but determined that there is now a IFD 540 bundle with nav and obstacles. Priced both 440 bundle and 540 bundle. Both were $685.
Which is a $95 increase from last year. Savings at Sun n Fun was two additional months.
I believe that the $491 price is for nav data only, may have to go back to that if they keep increasing the bundle price.

Craig

I wonder what adding charts to that would cost?  I do enjoy having the taxi diagrams on my IFD540, and I *Think* I need chart data to have that.  

Does that $685 bundle include the data needed for the IFD100 app?


Posted By: chflyer
Date Posted: 07 Apr 2019 at 5:01am
Absolutely right Steve!

-------------
Vince


Posted By: Craig767
Date Posted: 07 Apr 2019 at 7:07pm
Originally posted by CubedRoot CubedRoot wrote:

Originally posted by Craig767 Craig767 wrote:

I updated at Sun n Fun. The guy that helped me was not too knowledgeable but determined that there is now a IFD 540 bundle with nav and obstacles. Priced both 440 bundle and 540 bundle. Both were $685.
Which is a $95 increase from last year. Savings at Sun n Fun was two additional months.
I believe that the $491 price is for nav data only, may have to go back to that if they keep increasing the bundle price.

Craig

I wonder what adding charts to that would cost?  I do enjoy having the taxi diagrams on my IFD540, and I *Think* I need chart data to have that.  

Does that $685 bundle include the data needed for the IFD100 app?

Yes bundle is all that is needed for IFD100. 

Craig


Posted By: HenryM
Date Posted: 07 Apr 2019 at 8:34pm
Don’t expect approach charts on the IFD100 if you don’t get them in a bundle from Jepp. The $685 bundle doesn’t include them.


Posted By: CubedRoot
Date Posted: 07 Apr 2019 at 8:44pm
Any idea on what a "bundle" that has charts, nav and obstacles normally costs?  It seems like 1400 a year that am paying to be a bit....high.


Posted By: teeth6
Date Posted: 07 Apr 2019 at 8:49pm
I believe it depends on the coverage you want and the number of devices you want the charts to be used on. I have full US but not any of Canada and 2 devices only and I think I was at about $1100.


Posted By: HenryM
Date Posted: 07 Apr 2019 at 9:38pm
I prefer to just get nav and obstacles for my IFD540. I use ForeFlight on my iPad. if I wanted Jepp charts, I’d get a subscription through ForeFlight. I find the screen on the panel is not large enough for the charts to be really useful to me. 


Posted By: Alouicious
Date Posted: 07 Apr 2019 at 10:00pm
For a 540 & 440 'bundle' with charts, 14 month (continental US only) subscription at SnF was $940.30, same as last year, but that was less than the year before ($1011.30) due to Garmin having some sort of competition for something.
Jacob Johnson took the order: Senior Customer (Service) guy.   He said emails to captain@jeppesen.com went to only him and his assistant.
Try him for the real deal, though SnF is over, he may help...
Good luck!


-------------
Be happy! Your choice.


Posted By: allenc3
Date Posted: 08 Apr 2019 at 2:29am
I did the same for my 440 but $411 for east cost (including Texas) no charts, as 440 cant use them (I use Foreflight charts anyway). 14 months (two free).

-------------
Claude


Posted By: Bob H
Date Posted: 15 Apr 2019 at 8:50pm
Originally posted by CubedRoot CubedRoot wrote:

Originally posted by George P George P wrote:

Why so much?  I just paid my subscription and it was $491 for US coverage.  Are you getting approach charts too?

I have no freaking clue, and this is why I ABSOLUTELY HATE that we have to use Jeppessen for this stuff.  I have no idea what I am getting with these jerks, and have no idea what I even need.   When I called them, I told them I had an IFD540 and she said this was all they had available and that was the price.  

Jeppessen are absolute scumbags when it comes to this sort of stuff.
I find this appalling. Jepp just doesn't seem to train their people. Fortunately, I've had pretty good luck in dealing with them. I was given an "al la carte" menu of options and was able to choose only what I wanted. Others here with the 540 who didn't want charts could get the 440 package without charts at a lower price. At Sun-N-Fun last year, I was given a price sheet by one rep. but was told by another that it was out of date and no longer accurate. This level of incompetence is inexcusable. Their website is impossible to navigate to understand packages and pricing. To pay an invoice online, you can't just go to your account, you have to enter the account number, invoice number, and the amount owed. It's as if they have no record of the invoice.

I have:

1. East/Central US NAV (Don't need full US) $404.00
2. NE US Charts $358.00 (Don't do much flying out of the NE and can get a trip kit when I do.)
3. I get IFD100 automatically with the above. No need for some kind of "bundle".

There is no need for terrain as it hasn't changed since 2015. I don't subscribe to obstacles, but rather update periodically as I feel necessary.

I think you should call Jepp back and escalate the issue of having been mislead by an untrained customer service rep. Then go for what you actually want and need. Good luck.

-------------
Bob


Posted By: comancheguy
Date Posted: 16 Apr 2019 at 1:53pm
I just got my Jepp renewal Invoice.  

NavData East / Central US - IFR  IFD540        $274   x2   = $548.  

I'd have to look and see what I paid last year.  I usually renew at Osh or S&F, but I forgot at S&F. 

What does a trip tick cost?   


Ken





Posted By: CubedRoot
Date Posted: 16 Apr 2019 at 2:05pm
Hmm.. why the heck is everyone getting soooo many different prices for the same stuff?

This is what is completely frustrating.


Posted By: nrproces
Date Posted: 17 Apr 2019 at 8:05am
Because "They" (jepp) are a "sales" team, not an open store. If they were to post the prices, then some peoples commissions would go down, and others would not make their quotas. JMO


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Sauce


Posted By: arkvet
Date Posted: 18 Apr 2019 at 9:45am
Originally posted by comancheguy comancheguy wrote:

I just got my Jepp renewal Invoice.  

NavData East / Central US - IFR  IFD540        $274   x2   = $548.  

I'd have to look and see what I paid last year.  I usually renew at Osh or S&F, but I forgot at S&F. 

What does a trip tick cost?   


Ken







My IFD 550 renewal (due next month) is $404 for the NavData East/Central. I wonder is the $274 price because you have 2 or would it be worth making a call to see if I can get it cheaper.

-------------
Brent

PA32-301
IFD550 / AXP322 / SkyTrax100


Posted By: comancheguy
Date Posted: 18 Apr 2019 at 10:10am
That is supposed to be "the bundle" price for mulitples.  But, I have never actually seen it be cheaper that the price for one, times two.   

Who knows?  

I am a bit frustrated that I can't get plates on the IFD-100 without spending a LOT more $$$.   (More than a foreflight IFR subscription costs).     WAY more. 

Which makes the IFD-100 kind of pointless.   

I end up just running foreflight and not using the IFD-100 at all. 

Ken






Posted By: arkvet
Date Posted: 18 Apr 2019 at 10:46am
The IFD 100 app in my plane is on a 2nd ipad (panel mounted) and typically has the moving map view with weather displayed. The large screen allows me to see a bigger picture of my flight. If I'm IMC and choose to put the 550 in Synthetic vision then the IFD 100 comes in very handy for that moving map / FMS display.

I've never really wanted charts on any IFD device. I'll stick with foreflight on the yoke Ipad for that.

-------------
Brent

PA32-301
IFD550 / AXP322 / SkyTrax100


Posted By: comancheguy
Date Posted: 18 Apr 2019 at 11:31am
Point taken.  I'll give it another try. 

ken




Posted By: Kentucky Captain
Date Posted: 19 Apr 2019 at 3:06am
I only get the nav data package from Jeppesen.  My thought process on this is as follows:

The obstruction database changes very slowly.  Even so, as long as you are IFR, you are going to be above MVA and no new obstruction will be tall enough to challange that. If I'm VFR, I still have 2 iPads with Foreflight on them that have current obstructions.

The terrain database really does not change either.

My IFD540 is in the center stack and is not very practical for using charts on it as it is hard to see the detail needed for an approach.  I always display the approach plates on my iPad which is at eye level so I don't have to have my head down.

So, as I said, I only subscribe to the nav data and my annual bill is now due at $404.  At any time I think I need a database update, I can do it then.  So far, I haven't felt the need.


-------------
I was spending my kid's inheritance, one upgrade at a time but found that was too slow. Now I'm doing multiple upgrades at once.


Posted By: SB Jim
Date Posted: 22 Apr 2019 at 1:59pm
Originally posted by AviSteve AviSteve wrote:

Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

I am also frustrated with the cost of Jepps. What would it take for Avidyne modify the software to be able use NACO data form Seattle Avionics?
It's a much bigger job than you would think.  We have other more important stuff to be working on - like RF legs - right Vince (chflyer)?
Seriously?

RF legs are a rarity. Affordable updates could benefit everyone who owns one of these boxes.

Perhaps I’ve misunderstood - or humor is involved?

Jim


Posted By: AviSteve
Date Posted: 22 Apr 2019 at 2:40pm
Not kidding at all.  RF legs are not as uncommon as you might think - and getting more common every day.  That's especially true in Europe.  Not that RF legs are the only thing we're working on, but it's one of a couple top priorities.

-------------
Steve Lindsley
Avidyne Engineering


Posted By: chflyer
Date Posted: 22 Apr 2019 at 3:49pm
Thanks Steve.

Yes, this is becoming a big deal in Europe and lack thereof is a significant competitive disadvantage vs G* who already support RF legs.


-------------
Vince


Posted By: paulr
Date Posted: 23 Apr 2019 at 5:23am
Originally posted by SB Jim SB Jim wrote:

Originally posted by AviSteve AviSteve wrote:

Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

I am also frustrated with the cost of Jepps. What would it take for Avidyne modify the software to be able use NACO data form Seattle Avionics?
It's a much bigger job than you would think.  We have other more important stuff to be working on - like RF legs - right Vince (chflyer)?
Seriously?

RF legs are a rarity. Affordable updates could benefit everyone who owns one of these boxes.



If you search "Seattle" on this forum you'll see that we've had this discussion several times. See http://forums.avidyne.com/slingshot-wireless_topic1565_post19377.html?KW=seattle#19377" rel="nofollow - this post for a succinct summary.


Posted By: Flybuddy
Date Posted: 23 Apr 2019 at 3:52pm
Thanks for the link as it answered a basic question of no other option being readily available. Wonder if anyone has approached Steve P at SA if he was interested in building/marketing a database?
I'm new to the IFD product and feel a bit at risk that the only company we can use for data:
1) costs more than my aircraft insurance including hull
2) owned by an "airline" company that may not have GA best interests in mind
3) that airline company is going through a rough time
4) does not publish simple pricing and products on a website
5) rates and info vary depending on who you speak with
6) the inefficiency of 4&5 increase their labor costs and carries over to our pricing
7) monopoly with zero competition
Obviously additional options would be welcome and would be a better selling point to prospective new buyers.


Posted By: teeth6
Date Posted: 23 Apr 2019 at 4:15pm
i believe Avidyne has said that the engineering that would be involved to use other charts makes it highly unlikely that this will be done in the foreseeable future.


Posted By: MysticCobra
Date Posted: 24 Apr 2019 at 4:30pm
Originally posted by Flybuddy Flybuddy wrote:

4) does not publish simple pricing and products on a website
...
7) monopoly with zero competition
Obviously additional options would be welcome and would be a better selling point to prospective new buyers.
Re: website, don't worry...if you call and complain about the lousy website, they'll tell you "We know; we're working on it."  I know, because I've complained the last three years when renewing over the phone, and that's the response they always give me.  I think it's probably painted on the wall where they can just read it off easily.

I chose Avidyne before Garmin started offering their own data option separate from Jepp.  My experience with Jeppesen has been so consistently abysmal for the 10 years I've been dealing with them that I could very well have chosen to go with Garmin simply to avoid dealing with Jepp any more, had I known at the time.  The fact that this is a perennial topic of discussion on this forum seems to indicate I may not be the only one who feels that way.


Posted By: George P
Date Posted: 24 Apr 2019 at 4:46pm
My feelings exactly.


Posted By: Paul
Date Posted: 24 Apr 2019 at 5:43pm
Jepp's goal seems to be to drive everyone to products which don't use their data.  It is a very strange business model.


Posted By: rolfe_tessem
Date Posted: 25 Apr 2019 at 8:54am
They should hire a high school kid to revamp their website...

Rolfe



Posted By: LANCE
Date Posted: 25 Apr 2019 at 9:10am
If you just call and order, the process is fine. Their people are nice to deal with. 

Better yet if you're going to Oshkosh or Sun 'n Fun go see them, the process is very pleasant and you get a few extra months. I am a COPA member and automatically get 3 months free - then they add on the airshow discount.

This subject has been beaten to death and it's obvious that some people just like to complain, others look for the positive in life.


Posted By: oskrypuch
Date Posted: 25 Apr 2019 at 2:31pm
Originally posted by LANCE LANCE wrote:

If you just call and order, the process is fine. Their people are nice to deal with. ...

I quite like Jepp's product, and have used their plates and maps for years.

True, their website is useless, but I just always call in, and that is perhaps once every few years. You typically don't wait very long, and usually get someone that is helpful and knowledgeable.

They are not "cheap" by any means, and for a Canada/US subscription, we really get hosed. But in the grand scheme of things, it is not a large cost when it comes to owning and operating an aircraft.

* Orest


Posted By: chflyer
Date Posted: 26 Apr 2019 at 5:52am
It seems that Boeing is trying to recover their 737 Max losses through Jeppesen GA customers. My Jepp IFD540 navdata subscription renewal price just went up 25%.

Grrrrrr.


-------------
Vince


Posted By: MysticCobra
Date Posted: 27 Apr 2019 at 6:29am
Originally posted by LANCE LANCE wrote:

If you just call and order, the process is fine. Their people are nice to deal with. 
...
This subject has been beaten to death and it's obvious that some people just like to complain, others look for the positive in life.
It's true that the people are nice.  And if you are doing something simple, like renewing a plan you already have, then the process is fine.

But there are dozens of posts on here about folks trying to figure out pricing plans, and getting different stories from different reps.  For a long time, there was no clear story on whether 540 owners could buy a bundle comparable to the 440 bundle that did not include charts.  I once spent 40 minutes on the phone with a rep on that very question, and was assured that if I gave her a couple of weeks, she'd make something happen for me.  I finally heard from her again about six months later after someone familiar with the perennial discussions and confusion here spoke with her at either SnF or OSH and she went "oh crap" and remembered that she never got back with me.

In the meantime, someone here had figured out that the 440 no-chart bundle would work on the 540, so I had already called and gotten that package from another rep.  Thank goodness that Jepp's customers can experiment and figure out on their own how to get the products from Jepp that they want.  

The fact that someone might suggest waiting for one of two annual opportunities to fly halfway across the country to deal with them as a workaround to pulling up their website pretty much says it all.

I know there's no good solution for Avidyne to provide an option instead of Jepp on the IFD products.  But maybe the next time they build a product, they'll remember all the wailing and gnashing of teeth they had to put up with this time, and try harder to come up with alternatives.

It's not that I like to complain.  I don't, and I really don't complain like this about anyone else.  Not the phone company.  Not the cable company.  Not the IRS.  Not the FAA.  Not Obama or Trump.  Not anyone.

The amount of aggravation Jepp has managed to cause me over the years is so disproportionately high considering their very tiny place in my life.


Posted By: Awful Charlie
Date Posted: 28 Apr 2019 at 3:07am
Originally posted by chflyer chflyer wrote:

It seems that Boeing is trying to recover their 737 Max losses through Jeppesen GA customers. My Jepp IFD540 navdata subscription renewal price just went up 25%.

Grrrrrr.


They tried this on me too (up from ~EUR1750 to ~EUR2300)
I called them, and the helpful Julie took the problem away, found it, and then resolved it by cancelling the old invoice and re-issuing a new one (took 2 days), emailing updates as they occurred.
Back to last years (albeit still high) price, but thanks where it is due.


Posted By: Awful Charlie
Date Posted: 28 Apr 2019 at 3:11am
Originally posted by oskrypuch oskrypuch wrote:

...
They are not "cheap" by any means, and for a Canada/US subscription, we really get hosed. But in the grand scheme of things, it is not a large cost when it comes to owning and operating an aircraft.
* Orest

You think you get hosed!?
I'd disagree about the cost though - it is more than my hangarage, my mandatory insurance, and a bog-stock (no defects) annual inspection


Posted By: chflyer
Date Posted: 29 Apr 2019 at 5:52am
Yes, Jepp prices in Europe are really out of this world especially for charts.

Getting charts on the IFD adds about $720. And that's using the special bundle pricing that according to Jepp is supposed to "save" money. Needless to say, I've passed on the charts for the IFD. I only get navdata and obstacles directly from Jepp for the IFD and get the charts separately as a ForeFlight add-on.

Non-Jepp IFR charts are available from various sources in Europe, similar to the US. The alternative is not as attractive as in the US though because each of the 30 or so countries in Europe has their own presentation format which adds a mental overhead. The single format worldwide is the big Jepp advantage when reviewing charts.


-------------
Vince


Posted By: Flyer2017
Date Posted: 12 Jul 2019 at 12:33pm
IFD owners have been asking for years for an alternative to Jepp data. I'm not a programmer but can't believe that it could be so difficult to add the option of buying chart data from Seattle Avionics. They provide data to a wide range of companies including Bendix-King. Just the prospect would probably bring down Jepp's pricing some. Does Avidyne get a commission on data bought for their products?


Posted By: MysticCobra
Date Posted: 12 Jul 2019 at 3:45pm
Originally posted by Flyer2017 Flyer2017 wrote:

I'm not a programmer but can't believe that it could be so difficult to add the option of buying chart data from Seattle Avionics.
I am one of the loudest complainers regarding Jepp.  However, Avidyne has made it clear in past replies on this topic that it's not a matter of programming, it is a matter of data products.  The data provided by Seattle Avionics is not equivalent to what Jepp provides, especially outside of the United States, but even in the US they don't provide the same data.  I don't remember the details but it's something like "whatever data you need to be an IFR-legal/certified GPS, Seattle Avionics doesn't provide that".

It's literally that there is no other game in town.  With Garmin devices, they have two options for data subscriptions:  Jepp and Garmin.  Pretty sure we're not going to get (or want) Garmin as an option for data.  I don't know if we could ever hope for Avidyne to get into the data-provider biz and solve our problems that way.


Posted By: Flybuddy
Date Posted: 14 Jul 2019 at 4:01pm
This is from the Seattle Avionics site:
"The Seattle Avionics Data Manager provides ChartData to about a dozen different apps and devices - certified, non-certified, portable devices, in-panel systems, you name it.  Now new Data Manager version 5.3.6 takes everything to a whole new level of reliability and functionality. And for those who use multiple USB flash drives or data cards, you're in for quite a treat as it can now copy to multiple cards/flash drives simultaneously!"


Posted By: HenryM
Date Posted: 14 Jul 2019 at 6:32pm
Chart data is different than approach information. I’ve heard the SA information is not complete for iIFR use, but do t know all the details.


Posted By: MysticCobra
Date Posted: 15 Jul 2019 at 1:54pm
Originally posted by Flybuddy Flybuddy wrote:

This is from the Seattle Avionics site:
"The Seattle Avionics Data Manager provides ChartData to about a dozen different apps and devices - certified, non-certified, portable devices, in-panel systems, you name it.  Now new Data Manager version 5.3.6 takes everything to a whole new level of reliability and functionality. And for those who use multiple USB flash drives or data cards, you're in for quite a treat as it can now copy to multiple cards/flash drives simultaneously!"
This is also from the SA website:  "Each subscription currently includes FAA-certified approach plates, Mins, Arrival Procedures, Departure Procedures and geo-referenced airport diagrams."  All sorts of chart data (thus the name), but no mention of terrain or obstacle data.


Posted By: Flybuddy
Date Posted: 15 Jul 2019 at 2:58pm
I emailed SA about the possibility and this was their response:

"There aren't any direct plans to add the Avidyne data at the moment, but we definitely aren't opposed to the idea! If I recall the discussion has been bouncing around, just stay tuned!"


Posted By: Flyer2017
Date Posted: 15 Jul 2019 at 4:01pm
That's the same response I have gotten at SNF and OSH for the last two years. I'm sure Seattle Avionics would love to sell the data. I think it is Avidyne's internal priorities that are holding up the union. The more people who email, visit the booth at OSH, etc and express a preference, the sooner it might happen.


Posted By: HenryM
Date Posted: 15 Jul 2019 at 6:43pm
Any news on new bundles with Jeppesen, @AviSteve? There was a discussion a while back that something was in the works. I just got an invoice for my renewal today. Price for the IFD440 bundle (that I use on my IFD540) went up almost $100 since last year.


Posted By: CubedRoot
Date Posted: 15 Jul 2019 at 11:09pm
Same here. Mine has been expired for a while now but I’m waiting to see if anything comes from a package deal. I’m VFR right now anyways


Posted By: AZ Flyer
Date Posted: 16 Jul 2019 at 12:41am
Originally posted by HenryM HenryM wrote:

Any news on new bundles with Jeppesen, @AviSteve? There was a discussion a while back that something was in the works. I just got an invoice for my renewal today. Price for the IFD440 bundle (that I use on my IFD540) went up almost $100 since last year.

I dumped the obstacles and terrain updates and that saves about $150/year.  I have the full USA navdata with no charts (the IFD440 subscription).


Posted By: ddgates
Date Posted: 16 Jul 2019 at 9:04am
I did the same.




-------------
David Gates


Posted By: AviSteve
Date Posted: 16 Jul 2019 at 9:20am
Originally posted by HenryM HenryM wrote:

Any news on new bundles with Jeppesen, @AviSteve? There was a discussion a while back that something was in the works. I just got an invoice for my renewal today. Price for the IFD440 bundle (that I use on my IFD540) went up almost $100 since last year.
Look for updated coverages and new, better pricing in the next week or two.  We plan to have guidance in place to help Avidyne customers know exactly what to order from Jeppesen.  Stay tuned…


-------------
Steve Lindsley
Avidyne Engineering


Posted By: matthewsjl
Date Posted: 16 Jul 2019 at 12:27pm
If that guidance can come before OSH, it would be great. There are probably a few of us renewing or starting a subscription at OSH.

Thanks,

John


Posted By: AviSteve
Date Posted: 16 Jul 2019 at 3:38pm
It's unlikely that will happen just because the product part numbers are still being created.  I'm sure that if you start or renew a subscription at OSH, then you'll be able to get an adjustment once the new products and pricing are available.  I'll do my best to update the forum as things roll out.

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Steve Lindsley
Avidyne Engineering


Posted By: Flybuddy
Date Posted: 22 Jul 2019 at 11:05am
For those at Oshkosh, please let us know what specials Jepp may have. Unless it's something really good it's probably best to wait and see what Steve passes on.


Posted By: matthewsjl
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2019 at 10:43am
2mo free when renewing a sub.

Full USA with terrain and obstacles is 550 (590 after tax). East USA only (no terrain/obstacles) was about 100 less.

Saw Bonnie at Jepp - she gave me the commitment that if/when new pricing was announced that adjustments could be made. 

John


Posted By: Flybuddy
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2019 at 2:59pm
Originally posted by matthewsjl matthewsjl wrote:

2mo free when renewing a sub.

Full USA with terrain and obstacles is 550 (590 after tax). East USA only (no terrain/obstacles) was about 100 less.

Saw Bonnie at Jepp - she gave me the commitment that if/when new pricing was announced that adjustments could be made. 

John


Thx for the info...funny thing is I just got an invoice for my 440 in the mail today. Same services they gave you for $550-Full USA data plus terrain and obstacles for $940.


Posted By: Rangemaster_Tango
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2019 at 8:36pm
Thanks Steve...the pricing from Jepp has been a pain point for a while.  It will be nice if you can provide some clarity once available.  My renewal is up in August...


Posted By: LANCE
Date Posted: 27 Jul 2019 at 10:42am
Originally posted by matthewsjl matthewsjl wrote:

2mo free when renewing a sub.

Full USA with terrain and obstacles is 550 (590 after tax). East USA only (no terrain/obstacles) was about 100 less.

Saw Bonnie at Jepp - she gave me the commitment that if/when new pricing was announced that adjustments could be made. 

John

I also went to Bonnie Jurus again and she's great, also got the same confirmation that when the new pricing comes out she will make the adjustment over the phone.


Posted By: Flybuddy
Date Posted: 11 Aug 2019 at 2:34pm
Originally posted by AviSteve AviSteve wrote:

Look for updated coverages and new, better pricing in the next week or two.  We plan to have guidance in place to help Avidyne customers know exactly what to order from Jeppesen.  Stay tuned…


Steve, almost a month..Anything happening on this or is it just the usual Jepptalk? I recently got the invoice below to initiate service after the free period ended. It's for a 440. I'm waiting on either them getting a real web site with same pricing for everyone or a special deal for Avidyne..thx

https://ibb.co/SfZJGB8


Posted By: AviSteve
Date Posted: 11 Aug 2019 at 3:56pm
Originally posted by Flybuddy Flybuddy wrote:

Originally posted by AviSteve AviSteve wrote:

Look for updated coverages and new, better pricing in the next week or two.  We plan to have guidance in place to help Avidyne customers know exactly what to order from Jeppesen.  Stay tuned…


Steve, almost a month..Anything happening on this or is it just the usual Jepptalk? I recently got the invoice below to initiate service after the free period ended. It's for a 440. I'm waiting on either them getting a real web site with same pricing for everyone or a special deal for Avidyne..thx

https://ibb.co/SfZJGB8
Should be more detail available on pricing by the 15th (this week).  Don't hold your breath for their website, though.  They are working on it, but it's not happening quickly.


-------------
Steve Lindsley
Avidyne Engineering


Posted By: ddgates
Date Posted: 11 Aug 2019 at 4:26pm
Thanks for the effort, Steve.

This is long overdue, whatever you come up with.



-------------
David Gates


Posted By: CubedRoot
Date Posted: 11 Aug 2019 at 4:31pm
Looking forward to seeing whats announced.  My plan has been expired for a while now, as I was waiting to see what got announced.  I've held off my IFR training until I can get my GPS charts and databases updated :-)


Posted By: teeth6
Date Posted: 11 Aug 2019 at 6:33pm
Bonnie Juris at Jeppesen said that if the new plan with Avidyne is any better than an existing plan we have, that you can change over easily. There’s no need to keep waiting.


Posted By: MysticCobra
Date Posted: 14 Aug 2019 at 6:20pm
Originally posted by teeth6 teeth6 wrote:

Bonnie Juris at Jeppesen said that if the new plan with Avidyne is any better than an existing plan we have, that you can change over easily. There’s no need to keep waiting.
With all due respect to Bonnie, I've never had anything go easy when dealing with Jeppesen, so I would not want to be the first one to forge that path.


Posted By: HenryM
Date Posted: 14 Aug 2019 at 6:22pm
I just got another Jepp e-mail reminding me I need to renew my plan. I hope there's new pricing available soon! I need to renew by early September.


Posted By: teeth6
Date Posted: 14 Aug 2019 at 6:25pm
You wouldn’t be the first.  I’ve dealt with Bonnie for 2 years and she’s moved me into a better suited plan and credited me the difference before. 


Posted By: Flybuddy
Date Posted: 14 Aug 2019 at 6:40pm
Originally posted by teeth6 teeth6 wrote:

Bonnie Juris at Jeppesen said that if the new plan with Avidyne is any better than an existing plan we have, that you can change over easily. There’s no need to keep waiting.


It's a matter of trust...not so much in an individual employee like Bonnie but in the overall company making promises that aren't kept. The need to keep waiting is that if enough customers are able to put off their renewals it might actually motivate them toward positive change.


Posted By: MysticCobra
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2019 at 10:41am
It's nice that she was able to help you.  Bonnie once promised me that she would help me, too, but fell through on that promise.  I eventually--after learning from others' experiences and posts here--how to ask the right questions to get what I needed from Jepp.  

Also, I've heard the "We're working on our website" story from Jepp FOR FOUR YEARS NOW.  C'mon...really?

I don't trust any promises from that company or its reps.


Posted By: CubedRoot
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2019 at 10:49am
Originally posted by AviSteve AviSteve wrote:

Originally posted by Flybuddy Flybuddy wrote:

Originally posted by AviSteve AviSteve wrote:

Look for updated coverages and new, better pricing in the next week or two.  We plan to have guidance in place to help Avidyne customers know exactly what to order from Jeppesen.  Stay tuned…


Steve, almost a month..Anything happening on this or is it just the usual Jepptalk? I recently got the invoice below to initiate service after the free period ended. It's for a 440. I'm waiting on either them getting a real web site with same pricing for everyone or a special deal for Avidyne..thx

https://ibb.co/SfZJGB8
Should be more detail available on pricing by the 15th (this week).  Don't hold your breath for their website, though.  They are working on it, but it's not happening quickly.

Hey AviSteve, and updates on the new pricing?  


Posted By: AviSteve
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2019 at 2:01pm
The new product bundles and pricing are available today if you call Jeppesen.  The latest information I have is still "draft" so I don't want to publish it.  I should have final numbers/offerings by the end of the day.

We're working toward a point where we can make Avidyne customers aware of a "product number" in order to clarify the ordering process when talking to a Jeppesen representative.

I think you all (OK, most of you) will be happy with the new bundles.  The goal was to be as good or better than our main competitor.  For instance, Jeppesen has been offering a bundle consisting of nav/obstacle for a GNS that included charts for a mobile device.  The new Avidyne bundles will include one like that.  If you get that bundle for the 440, you'll be able to get charts on the IFD100.

So give them a call.  I'll be interested to hear what you're quoted for prices.  If that doesn't match up with our expectation, we'll approach it from our side as well.  The new prices should save you some $$, so I'm interested to hear individual experiences there too.


-------------
Steve Lindsley
Avidyne Engineering


Posted By: ddgates
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2019 at 4:19pm
Steve:

Your post sounds like music. The history has been wide price variablility, differing service levels and product IDs, and poor communications.

I would like a format where i can look at a product sheet, compare services and pricing, and then call Jepp, and no matter who I get on the other end, I want to be able to say, “please sign me up for #123456, which has obstacles, navdata, terrain, and USA charts for $XXX#”, and somebody else can do the same thing and get the same services and cost.  

Looking forward to a posting of where to look at bundles.  Thanks for the efforts.



-------------
David Gates


Posted By: HenryM
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2019 at 4:40pm
I just called, but the lady I spoke too didn't seem to really know what their pricing is. I will try again tomorrow.

First she gave me a price for the 440 bundle. She said $640 and it included charts for the IFD100. She didn't really know if I could use the mobile seat for something like ForeFlight. It would be the same price without charts. This was the price I'd been quoted before today. Guess there's an option to get free mobile charts for the IFD440 bundle.

Then she told me the price was the same for an IFD540 bundle. I asked how much the 540 bundle was with charts (for the IFD540) and she said $940. I asked for just nav data and she said $915. I said I thought she just told me it was $640 for navdata and obstacles, but she said that was for the 440 and different for the 540. I am 100% sure she had just told me the prices were the same for the 440 and 540 just a few minutes earlier.

I inquired about an Americas bundles and she said is was $1165 for either the 440 or 540, including charts. I was going to get a 540 bundle, but then she said I also had to get the 440 bundle. That the 540 one only worked if I got the 440 bundle first.

All in all, not impressed at all with the interaction. Her story changed every few minutes, as we talked of different options. She seemed confused to me. I will try again tomorrow, as the pricing in the past has depended mostly on which rep I reached. It was a 25 minute wait on hold to get through, though. No fun.

I need to renew my subscription in the next couple of weeks. If you have even a draft version of what to expect, Steve, I'd appreciate getting a copy so I can tell the rep what kind of bundle I want. The prices don't have to be super accurate, but it would help to tell the rep what bundle I want and what order of magnitude the price should be.


Posted By: MysticCobra
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2019 at 5:47pm
Originally posted by AviSteve AviSteve wrote:

I think you all (OK, most of you) will be happy with the new bundles. 
It's possible you're looking at me (among others) with that comment, Steve.  To be clear:
  • I have never had a problem with the quality of Jepp's products
  • While I have struggled in the past to get Jepp to sell me the product I wanted, I am currently happy with the package I have ("440 bundle" (data with no charts) used on a 540)
My unhappiness has always primarily been that dealing with Jepp to actually get what I want is a PITA (see Henry's post above).  (And secondarily that I feel like the prices are probably way higher than they should be, because monopoly.)  


Posted By: CubedRoot
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2019 at 9:17pm
What really irks me about Jeppesen is there is not standard pricing.  The prices you get vary WILDLY depending on the mood of the person on the phone, the day you call, the sales persons SKU knowledge, etc.  Its not standardized, even the the end result is the same dang product.  

And its a HUGE pain in the neck to talk to them on the phone....just to renew!  It's 2019 already... I can buy pretty much anything online, 24x7.  


Posted By: forkauto
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2019 at 7:47am
back on 6/10/19 I purchased a year of data for my 550. I paid $1274.76 for a complete package including charts for the 550 and IFD100. Here's hoping the price is cheaper


Posted By: paulr
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2019 at 8:52am
Originally posted by CubedRoot CubedRoot wrote:

What really irks me about Jeppesen is there is not standard pricing.  The prices you get vary WILDLY depending on the mood of the person on the phone, the day you call, the sales persons SKU knowledge, etc.  Its not standardized, even the the end result is the same dang product.  
 

CubedRoot *nailed* it.

The fact that we're even having a discussion about "I paid X to get Y. What did you pay?" is absurd. I'm satisfied with the quality of Jepp's products. I'm satisfied-ish with the ease of use of loading new databases etc. I don't even mind having to call to renew since that only happens once per year. But I dread renewals because I am always left feeling like I paid more than necessary. There's already so much of that in aviation (like the time a mechanic tried to charge me 8hr of labor to replace a mixture cable in my airplane when it was a 1.5hr job maximum) that I don't need it from these guys too.


Posted By: AviSteve
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2019 at 12:23pm
Hot off the presses...

I did get updated bundle and pricing information yesterday.  However, sadly, only one of the new bundles is actually available to be ordered when you call Jeppesen.  The others will roll out slowly through the rest of the year.  I wish I could give you dates, but couldn't get committments.

At this point, new ala carte pricing is available, varying based on the coverage region.  So, for instance, if your subscription is for "Full USA IFR NavData" ala carte (i.e. not bundled with anything else), then you should expect a price of $299 per year.  That's NavData for one IFD.

The new bundle that is now available is the "IFD400/500 Series Aircraft Bundle".  In that bundle, you get NavData, Obstacles, Terrain, and Charts for all IFDs in the aircraft and for another piece of Avidyne equipment* in the cockpit (e.g EX500/5000).  You also get the same set of data for up to two iPads running the IFD100.  Again, pricing varies based on coverage region, but for Full USA IFR, you should expect a price of $799.

We plan on putting together a page on our website that details all of the available data (ala carte and bundles) and associated prices on our website.  We don't have Jeppesen product codes at this point, but we're working on that and, once we have them, they will be published on the same web page.  Once that web page is live, I'll post a link to it.  Our goal with that is to make the interaction with Jeppesen much smoother and predictable.

* Ultimately, the bundle will allow for equipment from other compatible vendors (e.g. Dynon, Aspen, etc.), but those details are still being worked out.


-------------
Steve Lindsley
Avidyne Engineering


Posted By: teeth6
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2019 at 12:30pm
Thanks very much for all your hard work on this!!


Posted By: HenryM
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2019 at 12:30pm
Thank you, Steve. That is helpful. I hope the rest of the packages roll out soon. The NavData price is much better than before.

It would be nice if I could use one of the IFD100 seats on Foreflight.


Posted By: Fuz16
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2019 at 1:40pm
Steve,

Thank you for working on this.  Appreciate all that you do. 

Fred


Posted By: AviSteve
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2019 at 1:54pm
Note that I edited my post above for a late breaking update regarding other compatible equipment.  Basically, the bundle was initially set up for other Avidyne equipment (e.g. EX5000), but ultimately it will include equipment from other compatible vendors (e.g. Dynon, Aspen, ...)

-------------
Steve Lindsley
Avidyne Engineering


Posted By: ddgates
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2019 at 2:11pm
This is better.  

Yes other equipment inclusion (e.g. Aspen) would fit.


-------------
David Gates


Posted By: MysticCobra
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2019 at 5:03pm
Thanks, Steve.  Hope my current bundle (NavData, Obstacles, Terrain, but no charts) is still an option, and still includes a discount compared to the bundles that include charts.


Posted By: oskrypuch
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2019 at 5:26pm
Outstanding Steve!

Thanks for the hard work that this no doubt required, in the background, to make this happen.

* Orest


Posted By: AviSteve
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2019 at 5:30pm
Originally posted by MysticCobra MysticCobra wrote:

Thanks, Steve.  Hope my current bundle (NavData, Obstacles, Terrain, but no charts) is still an option, and still includes a discount compared to the bundles that include charts.
Yes, your bundle is still an option and should be the next one to roll out with new pricing.


-------------
Steve Lindsley
Avidyne Engineering


Posted By: teeth6
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2019 at 6:28pm
Steve

Do you have any idea if one of the future bundles will be full USA but also Canada and Bahamas?  That is the package I presently have.


Posted By: Flybuddy
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2019 at 7:20pm
Just got off phone with Jepp (took over an hour)..They had no idea of the pricing and after some more holds and checks they asked me to email them the link from the Avidyne site. I did that and after about 15 minutes they agreed to the pricing and I got full U.S. navdata for $299 :)
if you need, here's the Jepp Avidyne Pricing (JAP) link:
https://pilotsupport.avidyne.com/kb/article/353-jeppesen-pricing-for-avidyne-equipment/


Posted By: AviSteve
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2019 at 7:55pm
Originally posted by Flybuddy Flybuddy wrote:

If you need, here's the Jepp Avidyne Pricing (JAP) link:
https://pilotsupport.avidyne.com/kb/article/353-jeppesen-pricing-for-avidyne-equipment/
I'm always amazed at how quick you all are.  I took a few hours off for dinner and you beat me to the punch posting the link!

That's probably not the final version of the web page, but the pricing and product numbers won't change.  The only thing we might do is make the product descriptions a little easier to read.  Also, as the new bundles become available, we'll update that page to reflect the new offerings, again with product numbers and pricing.

Just so I feel better, here's the same link that you can click :)

https://pilotsupport.avidyne.com/kb/article/353-jeppesen-pricing-for-avidyne-equipment/" rel="nofollow - https://pilotsupport.avidyne.com/kb/article/353-jeppesen-pricing-for-avidyne-equipment/


-------------
Steve Lindsley
Avidyne Engineering


Posted By: HenryM
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2019 at 9:39pm
With the IFR bundles you get two mobile keys. Could you use one with ForeFlight and one with the IFD100? I use FF more than the IFD100.

Nice to see a documented price list, and similar bundles for the 500 and 400 series. 


Posted By: teeth6
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2019 at 9:52pm
Yes you could. I have 2 mobile keys now and that is what I do.


Posted By: HenryM
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2019 at 10:04pm
Originally posted by teeth6 teeth6 wrote:

Do you have any idea if one of the future bundles will be full USA but also Canada and Bahamas?  That is the package I presently have.

The list shows a North America bundle that I assume would include Canada and the Bahamas. I think previously there was only an America’s package, now they have that plus North America and South America.

What I would like is North America NavData and Obstacles. Hopefully that will happen soon. 



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