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matthewbward View Drop Down
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    Posted: 01 Dec 2020 at 11:13am
Broad question about getting the winds to calculate correctly in the 540:  Altitude loads from the GPS, I enter CAS as the IAS, the GPS knows the Heading, I enter the TAT as the OAT from the JPI, and I manually enter the nearest altimeter from Foreflight.  The TAS calculates correctly, and probably the DA too, but the winds are crazy.  It will show +80 knots headwind or something like that.  I've confirmed my units are correct (C vs. F, Mb vs InHg, etc).  Is there anything I may be missing to help me diagnose this?
Thanks!

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dmtidler View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dmtidler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec 2020 at 12:10pm
Originally posted by matthewbward matthewbward wrote:

Broad question about getting the winds to calculate correctly in the 540:  Altitude loads from the GPS, I enter CAS as the IAS, the GPS knows the Heading, I enter the TAT as the OAT from the JPI, and I manually enter the nearest altimeter from Foreflight.  The TAS calculates correctly, and probably the DA too, but the winds are crazy.  It will show +80 knots headwind or something like that.  I've confirmed my units are correct (C vs. F, Mb vs InHg, etc).  Is there anything I may be missing to help me diagnose this?
Thanks!


The wind calculation needs four basic items, TAS, GS, track, and HDG. TAS is calculated using altitude, temperature, and CAS...it sounds like the TAS component appears correct with your manual entries. GS and track are determined internally by your IFD540. What is providing the HDG information to your IFD540?

Also, what IFD software version is your IFD540 currently using?

 
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matthewbward View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote matthewbward Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec 2020 at 12:50pm
I thought Heading was coming from the Track on the GPS, but I guess it's possible that was set wrong. Version is 10.2.4.1

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dmtidler View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote dmtidler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec 2020 at 1:24pm
Without an external heading input or manual entry, the IFD540 doesn't know what the aircraft's heading is.

Edited by dmtidler - 02 Dec 2020 at 1:26pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote skitheo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec 2020 at 2:44pm
Originally posted by dmtidler dmtidler wrote:

Without an external heading input or manual entry, the IFD540 doesn't know what the aircraft's heading is.

Just to add emphasis that the above is correct. You need to input that from your compass if you don't have an ADAHRS source connected to the IFD540.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote matthewbward Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Dec 2020 at 10:56am
Something is still not right.  I checked it again this weekend on a really calm day.  Winds aloft were forecast at less than 10 knots.  Here is a picture of what my box is showing.  The 53 knot wind component is certainly not right.  The heading was pulled from the DG - I'm assuming it's using this to calculate the WCA or something like that.  Does anyone see anything non-sensical that I'm entering?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote paulr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Dec 2020 at 11:35am
I'd drop in to https://e6bx.com/e6b/ and have a look. If I plug in HDG 270, TAS 146, and wind 200 @ 53kts, I get a GS of 137. According to them, with the on-screen pressure altitude and OAT, with a CAS of 122, you'd get a TAS of 148. That all seems plausible. 

Without knowing your actual course, we can't know for sure, but course 291, TAS 146, wind 200 @ 53 gives a heading of 270 and a GS of 137.
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matthewbward View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote matthewbward Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Dec 2020 at 1:57pm
Thanks for that.  I would imagine the E6B calculations within the IFD are right; it's more likely my DG/Compass have errors that contribute to the problem.  I suppose my surprise is just in the sensitivity of the calculation.  A +- 10 degree error (which my compass probably has!) will get you from sensical to nonsensical winds aloft.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oskrypuch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Dec 2020 at 5:34pm
53 knots at 10,000 ft is not by any means "nonsensical".

There is often little relation to wind on the ground, and wind higher up, in particular the air is decoupled at the top of the boundary layer. What were the forecast winds at that altitude for your location?

* Orest


Edited by oskrypuch - 07 Dec 2020 at 5:35pm
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matthewbward View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote matthewbward Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Dec 2020 at 6:00pm
It would be entirely irresponsible to be flying a light airplane in +50 knot winds in the mountains of Colorado - it's ill advised to fly when winds aloft are much over 20 for most of us - and you would most certainly know you were doing it.  The same high pressure system is still sitting over the Steamboat Springs area and is currently showing out of 333 at 7 at 12k.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oskrypuch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Dec 2020 at 7:50pm
Ah. I seldom fly in the mountains of Colorado, but would agree. More than 20 knots or so, within 30 deg of the perpendicular to mountain ranges, and with an inversion just above, watch out. You didn't mention the specific circumstances.

That said, in the flat lands, I can see winds in the 70 to 80 knot range even at 7000ft, in the warm sector, just prior to a system rolling through. Smooth as silk, you wouldn't know without airdata.

* Orest


Edited by oskrypuch - 07 Dec 2020 at 9:39pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AndyMeyer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jan 2021 at 1:20pm
Small heading errors do result in significant wind errors. 
Take your old E6B and try changing the wind heading 10 or 20 degrees and you'll find a significant variation.
Imagine cruising at 150 knots tracking west bound... 20 knots on the nose for winds (270@20)
GS = 130 knots.

Now, if you put in a heading of 250 instead of 270, the winds to maintain a groundtrack of 270 and a GS of 130 is ~328@53 knots.

Accuracy plays big for wind computations.
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